Topics
- News and updates from Diane & Liz [2:03]
- Keto Quick Start
- Body Awareness Project
- Legacy Magazine article
- Hot topic in the news: La Croix [9:07]
- Keto and blood glucose readings [18:03]
- Safety of smoked seafood [32:41]
- What you're missing on Instagram [40:43]
The episodes are also available in iTunes, Spotify & Stitcher.
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You’re listening to the Balanced Bites podcast episode 370.
Diane Sanfilippo: Welcome to the Balanced Bites podcast. I’m Diane; a certified nutrition consultant, and the New York Times bestselling author of Practical Paleo and the 21-Day Sugar Detox. My newest book, Keto Quick Start, will release on January 1, 2019. I live in San Francisco with my husband and fur kids.
Liz Wolfe: I’m Liz; a nutritional therapy practitioner, and author of the Wall Street Journal bestseller Eat the Yolks; The Purely Primal Skincare Guide; and the online program Baby Making and Beyond. I live on a lake in the mystical land of the Midwest, outside of Kansas City.
We’re the co-creators of the Balanced Bites Master Class, and we’ve been bringing you this award-winning podcast for more than 7 years. We’re here to share our take on modern healthy living, answer your questions, and chat with leading health and wellness experts. Enjoy this week’s episode, and submit your questions at http://blog.balancedbites.com or watch the Balanced Bites podcast Instagram account for our weekly calls for questions. You can ask us anything in the comments.
Remember our disclaimer: The materials and content within this podcast are intended as general information only, and are not to be considered a substitute for professional medical advice, diagnosis, or treatment. Before we get started, let’s hear from one of our sponsors.
Liz Wolfe: Today’s podcast is sponsored by Vital Choice wild seafood and organics. America’s leading purveyor of premium, sustainable seafood and grass-fed meats, and a certified B corporation. As the days begin to cool down, it’s time for hearty, healthy, high protein foods. Vital Choice specializes in superior, sustainable wild fish and shellfish, which offer unrivaled bounties of omega-3 fats and vitamin D. You’ll also find mouthwatering grass-fed meats, organic bone broths, paleo friendly burgers, dogs, and bacon crafted from wild salmon, free-range bison, pastured pork, and organic grass-fed beef. Be sure to save 15% on one regular order with the promo code BBPODCAST or get $15 off your first Vital Box with the promocode BBVITALBOX from now through the end of the year.
1. News and updates from Diane & Liz [2:03]
Liz Wolfe: Ok; hi buddy! Hi Diane.
Diane Sanfilippo: Well hey there.
Liz Wolfe: What’s happening over there?
Diane Sanfilippo: I’m just saying we are trying to avoid the owl every time we go for a walk {laughs}.
Liz Wolfe: {laughs}
Diane Sanfilippo: Scott does not seem as phased by it as I have been. But in broad daylight I’m looking. After you told us that you saw one in the morning, I was like; are you sure you want to go that way, honey? Anyway. That’s what’s up.
No, but what’s happening. Keto book updates. Hopefully we’ve got the home stretch. Several weeks until the book will be off to print. And I’m super excited about that. Super excited for people to get this into their hands. And I know a couple of years ago, when I was dabbling in learning about a macros approach. Which, I think that’s a little bit of a broad sweeping statement. Anytime we look at adjusting our nutrition and trying to pay attention to how much of anything we’re eating in particular, we are paying attention to macronutrients.
But, I was using what I called a bingo sheet. Where I would lay out the goal of what I was trying to eat for the day in terms of protein, carbs, and fat. And it was super, super helpful. So that’s something I’m actually translating into this book with a keto approach to things. Which I think will be really helpful for people to see exactly all the food they’re supposed to eat in a day.
It’s very; I don’t know. I don’t know how else to say it about the approach that I have. It’s very much a “Please eat all of this.” Not, let’s limit our food. {laughs} I don’t know. So hopefully people will enjoy that and find it useful.
What else? Body Awareness Project for those of you who have not yet checked it out. When we have done episodes of the Balanced Bites podcast about adrenal health, they have been some of the most popular episodes. You guys have tons of questions about that, and the most recent installation. Is that the right word?
Liz Wolfe: Sounds good to me.
Diane Sanfilippo: In the most recent part of the Body Awareness Project has been on adrenal health. And I think you guys are really going to love it. I absolutely loved the chat that I had with Emily Schromm about being an entrepreneur. Being someone who is trying to run a business and basically not lose your mind, and what that means for your adrenals. So I think you guys will love that. And obviously, there are tons of other modules and interviews within that section. Within the adrenal health section of Body Awareness.
So, we know that several months ago there was one on skin health. Both you and I, Liz, participated in that. And this one is on adrenal health. So definitely check that out at Body Awareness project. So what’s going on over by the lake?
Liz Wolfe: Well, my interview with Legacy Magazine, which is a military spouse/family/community magazine, is live. And you can order; some folks were asking me how to order it. You don’t have to order a subscription to get the article that I was featured in. Let me see if I can get some kind of code or something like that.
Diane Sanfilippo: You look super famous being in this magazine.
Liz Wolfe: Super famous. Legacy is a really beautifully done magazine. And I was really, really excited to get featured in it. One of the things I talked about in the interview; I guess I’ll just read a quote, because I don’t know. I thought it was really good.
Diane Sanfilippo: {laughs}
Liz Wolfe: {laughs} One of the things I said was, “If parenthood was a job, I probably would have quit by now. Because I would have been like; I’m no good at this. This is not my field. I need to find something I’m good at and try doing that. But as people know, you can’t quit parenthood. You are locked in for life. So it’s been a real struggle for me just kind of adapting to that and wrapping my head around the fact that number one; it’s ok to not show up fully every day. There are going to be days that you can’t.” But one of the things I said is that, “I’m learning I’m stronger than I thought. I’m learning to be proud of myself and my vulnerability. I’m working to understand that struggle is part of the process. I found so much peace and accepting that struggle means you are actively working to love more and be better.”
And I don’t know. I thought that was pretty good. Pretty insightful on my part. But I do think it’s true. I think a lot of it depends on our perspective, especially in parenthood. This idea that; I’m struggling, what’s wrong? Versus; I’m struggling, I’m doing something right.
Diane Sanfilippo: Mm-hmm. I was only giggling because you and I have had so many conversations about this topic and how I think a lot of our listeners are always looking to improve in some ways. And a lot of times that can feel like you're doing something wrong in the moment. As opposed to it proving that you have a growth mindset, or you have a mindset of; I could be doing better. I just think there’s this divide between putting yourself down for feeling like you could be doing better, and patting yourself on the back for realizing; hey. I’m doing the best I can. It is good enough. And at the same time; isn’t that kind of the theme of what we always talk about?
Liz Wolfe: Pretty much.
Diane Sanfilippo: Be proud of yourself and accepting where you are, and understanding that that struggle is a positive thing. It means that you see more for yourself. And I think that’s ok.
Liz Wolfe: I think so too.
Diane Sanfilippo: But I’m proud of you. I think that’s awesome.
Liz Wolfe: Thanks. One of the cool things about the interview itself was; I think in parenthood, you just don’t give yourself time to sit and reflect sometimes. So everything you just said is true. But it was by no means was that on my radar. Until I actually had to sit down and answer these questions, and talk to the folks at Legacy Mag. And all of a sudden I was like; wow. I’m doing ok.
So I think, first of all, maybe create a little space for yourself to reflect on what you're doing. Because I think most people will come to the conclusion that they’re actually kind of kicking butt. At least more so than they thought.
Diane Sanfilippo: You know; and it’s like trust your friends who tell you you're kicking butt.
Liz Wolfe: Yeah. {laughs}
Diane Sanfilippo: I feel like I kept being like; Liz, I think you're doing a really great job. {laughs} I’m not just saying that. I really. I love and feel so proud of my friends when you have those moments of; actually, I’m awesome. I’m doing great. And you can see that. So I’m just super excited for you. And I’m so proud of you to be in this magazine. And proud of you for having; I don’t know. Having that point of view.
Liz Wolfe: Thank you. It was a beautiful photoshoot too.
Diane Sanfilippo: Yeah.
Liz Wolfe: It was really nice. So if anybody wants to go look for; it’s volume 3 of Legacy Magazine. You don’t have to subscribe to all future volumes, you can just buy my magazine.
Diane Sanfilippo: {laughs} Just get mine.
Liz Wolfe: Just get mine. And try the code, all caps, LIFEBALANCE, one word all caps, for 20% off. See if that still works by the time this podcast airs. Ok.
2. Hot topic in the news: La Croix [9:07]
Diane Sanfilippo: Ok.
Liz Wolfe: Lets move on to a little discussion about something that’s been in the news lately. La Croix.
Diane Sanfilippo: Yes.
Liz Wolfe: La Croix, our little buddy sparkling water. I mean, it’s not our favorite sparkling water. There’s a lot of different carbonated water that I have tried, and they mostly taste the same to me. But one of the most widely available sparkling water in a can. Which, I will tell you, Diane. Have I told you this already? Probably four times. I actually stopped drinking carbonated water. And my tooth sensitivity decreased dramatically quite quickly.
Diane Sanfilippo: Interesting.
Liz Wolfe: Yeah. I mean, not all that surprising but I was a little surprised. I wasn’t drinking it that much. I would open maybe one a day and usually the three of us here at the house would split it. So I wouldn’t have thought that level of intake would have caused problems. But it did for me. I just horrible teeth.
Diane Sanfilippo: Plain sparking water? What were you drinking?
Liz Wolfe: I was drinking canned. Just basically like La Croix. Not always La Croix, but some variation of that.
Diane Sanfilippo: I admitted have only tasted one sip of a La Croix ever.
Liz Wolfe: What?
Diane Sanfilippo: And I didn’t care for it. And never again. It’s just not my thing.
Liz Wolfe: You must have tasted the one that tastes like Chapstick.
Diane Sanfilippo: It was; I think it was a lemon lime or something it was supposed to taste like sprite or something like that. Literally, I thought someone was giving me water and I was really not that into it. But that’s me. I’m the girl who doesn’t like wine, and all the things that most people like I pretty much don’t like. So I just really did not care for it and have never tried it since then.
So the fiasco right now; a little bit about the whole “natural flavors” news. Do you want to update people on what’s going on? {laughs}
Liz Wolfe: Furiously Googling right now {laughs} to see what this is even about. You know I know nothing about it. So why don’t I give a comment on it?
Diane Sanfilippo: No, well there’s a couple of notes. I think there were three different constituents of natural flavors. I’m actually not that into the idea of using natural flavors to heighten or elevate the taste of something. I like the idea of a company putting a little bit of maybe an essential oil, and if they’re going to call it that, they call it that. Or maybe a food-grade, small quantity, whatever is safe for consumption in that way. Or perhaps they’re using an extract, like a vanilla extract or something like that.
But this has come up; this came up many years ago when someone said that; this is going to sound crazy. But the anal glands of beavers had a strawberry flavor that would be extracted from them.
Liz Wolfe: {laughs}
Diane Sanfilippo: I know, this is really weird.
Liz Wolfe: It sounds like it tastes better than liver.
Diane Sanfilippo: {laughs} It was a big controversy around this idea of natural flavors. So here’s a funny thing that happens in nature; things that we think taste a certain way, we actually can get flavor that tastes more like a real strawberry from something other than breaking down a strawberry and putting it into the drink. And this sounds kind of crazy, but it’s just how flavors and sense work, chemically speaking. And I’m not a chemist, as we know.
I did talk to somebody who I think was the owner of Hint water about this, and how the reason why they’ll say natural flavors is because it’s not always the strawberry that will give you the most “strawberry-like” flavor in a beverage when it’s taken in isolation from all of the other components that make up a whole strawberry.
So we know there are carbohydrates and fiber and phytochemicals. All types of things that make up a strawberry. And when those are all put together, it tastes like a strawberry. But if you were to try and break down that strawberry into an extract, it won’t as much like a strawberry without probably the phytochemicals. What makes it red, also gives it certain flavors.
So that’s perhaps a bit out there. But I think that lends itself to this discussion. Because there are specific isolated compounds that will taste more like a certain flavor than the fruit itself when it’s isolated. And that’s really what’s happening with something like La Croix, as far as I know. Is it limonene? Do you have the?
Liz Wolfe: Limonene, linalool, linalool propionate.
Diane Sanfilippo: There are three different compounds that were in question. And I think that what happens is people see these things, they see a chemical name. And we see this happen in skin care a lot. We presume that, unless we know exactly what it is, that it’s probably not safe. That’s what we assume, if we don’t know what it is. But the truth is, it may or may not actually be toxic at all. It may be perfectly safe to consume.
Some of the arguments are that it’s included in some insecticides maybe, one or two of those ingredients. That’s not really a relevant argument. Because there could be water in an insecticide. And that doesn’t mean that water is then not safe for us.
I think there are, despite the fact that I’m not necessarily a fan of enhancing waters, and stimulating our palates in a way that I just don’t think is that natural for every day frequent consumption. I don’t know that it’s unsafe. I think people are getting a little up in arms about it being unsafe. I think La Croix is obviously a really huge target. I think this is …
Liz Wolfe: It’s a hit job.
Diane Sanfilippo: It’s a hit job.
Liz Wolfe: {laughs}
Diane Sanfilippo: I think there are a lot of new companies coming out, and using juices. And all I can think is Coming to America where he says; “It’s nothing but juices and berries.”
Liz Wolfe: {laughing}
Diane Sanfilippo: {laughs} I’m an entrepreneur. That’s what he says. You guys, I’ve seen Coming to America way too many times. Ok, I digress.
So, I think that safety perspective; I think people are blowing things out of proportion and it’s probably not a big deal. I think it’s probably safe. That being said; I’m not a big fan of things that taste like something that are not there because of what I think that does to the human palate and our experience with food and the way that mother nature intended us to consume certain things and certain flavors and have these things happen.
But do I think that mean you're a bad person if you love La Croix and you have traded your diet soda addiction for La Croix? No. I think that’s a really great lateral shift. So it is what it is. Make your decision. But I would not freak out about it. And if you feel uncomfortable consuming it, then don’t. And opt for something like a plain sparkling water if you want to, or just regular water if it’s upsetting your teeth. I don’t have any dental sensitivity from drinking a crazy amount of sparkling water these days. I’ve been drinking San Pellegrino like crazy. But that’s my take. What is your take on this hot topic? {laughs} If it’s a hot topic.
Liz Wolfe: My take is; Diane Sanfilippo says don’t drink La Croix.
Diane Sanfilippo: {laughs} No that’s not what I said.
Liz Wolfe: {laughs} No. I agree with you 100%. I was going to say that exact same thing. It seems like somebody just googled linalool and found out it was in cockroach insecticide, and was like; yes! This is a good soundbite. So I think that’s 100% accurate. And I’m not all that worried about it either.
Liz Wolfe: The Balanced Bites podcast is sponsored in part by the Nutritional Therapy Association. The NTA trains and certifies nutritional therapy practitioners and consultants (including me; I’m an NTP), emphasizing bio-individuality and the range of dietary strategies that support wellness. The NTA emphasizes local, whole, properly prepared nutrient dense foods as the key to restoring balance and enhancing the body’s ability to heal.
The NTA’s nutritional therapy practitioner program and fully online nutritional therapy consultant program empower graduates with the education and skills needed to launch a successful, fulfilling career in holistic nutrition. If you're interested in learning about holistic nutrition but don’t necessarily want to become a practitioner, check out their new Foundational Wellness course. To learn more about the NTA’s nutritional therapy programs, resources, and to enroll in their free course, Nutritional Therapy 101, visit http://www.NutritionalTherapy.com.
3. Keto and blood glucose readings [18:03]
Liz Wolfe: Ok. So we’ve got two questions today; one on keto and blood sugar. And the second on the safety of smoked seafood. Should be interesting.
First question. “First of all, I want to thank you ladies for all the work you do in delivering great content to us. It’s always so relevant to me and my goals. I’m loving the new format for the podcast as well. The Q&As are always spot on, and I love hearing your take on these fitness, nutrition, and life topics.
I’m in need of some advice. I started eating for ketosis about two months ago; mainly for the brain benefits, as I’m 42, and have been experiencing memory issues and brain fog. This started back during pregnancy, so 7 years ago, or at least that’s when I remember noticing it. With my job and being a mom to a 6-year-old, I do experience stress pretty regularly, so this could be part of it, too. I try to manage it by exercising and meditation, and taking some time to myself by waking up at 5:30 to read and exercise before the little one gets up.
I’m also trying to lose some weight, but that could just be a bonus. I only had about 15-20 pounds to lose, and I’ve already dropped about 8. The other reason for switching to keto is that I’m a sugar addict. In the past, I’d go off sugar for months, and then I often relapse and fall into the trap for a few months before I get back on track. So far, I’m finding the keto diet easier to maintain, as I can eat all the yummy fats, never feel deprived, I’m never hungry, and my energy levels are much better. No more crash and burn.
Which brings me to my questions. I measure my blood sugar with a glucometer, and every morning it’s between 95 and 115 mg/dL. This seems high, since I’m eating low carb, keeping it under 20 grams of net carbs per day from veggies and a small serving of berries a few times a week. I measure at other times of the day, too, and it’s always around this level. Before lunch, after lunch, before bed. It’s stable, but high. Do you think I should be worried about this? I’m afraid to go to a doctor as they may say I have pre-diabetes and try to put me on medication. I don’t like pharmaceuticals, and try to avoid them at all costs. Any advice?
My other question is that after a more strenuous workout like spin class or Orange Theory, I feel really depleted, and my heart rate sometimes feels out of control during these workouts. I back it down during the workout to get my heart rate under control, but don’t remember feeling this way before the keto diet. Any reason for this? Are the two things possibly related?”
Diane Sanfilippo: Ok. I’m going to tackle this one.
Liz Wolfe: Ok. I’m just going to mute myself. {laughs}
Diane Sanfilippo: Ok. So, a couple of things. First and foremost, the slightly high fasting blood glucose; it’s not pathological meaning it’s not a disease state. And it’s a very normal physiological adaptation to not using glucose. But it’s not something you need to be concerned about.
The thing that we need to recognize about that slightly elevated fasting glucose is that when that is happening, but you're not also having that experience alongside high insulin, then it’s not a cause for concern.
So what you would normally see in somebody who is experiencing something like pre-diabetes or diabetes, they’re going to have both high insulin levels and high fasting glucose. Because remember, you have this increase in insulin, but your body is resistant to the signals. So it’s not pulling the glucose from your blood stream and getting it where it needs to go into your cells. So recognize that in the absence of high insulin, that slightly elevated fasting glucose is not pathological. So not a disease state. The body is not using that glucose. Especially when you wake up. It’s going to be a little bit elevated. It’s pretty normal for that to happen when your cortisol spikes a bit to wake you up. Poor sleep can definitely exacerbate the problem.
Now, when it comes to exercise. The question that she had about her heart rate; there are a couple of things going on here. First and foremost, I just wanted to address. She said she’s keeping it under 20 grams of net carbs per day from veggies and a small serving of berries a few times a week. I think that level is lower than it needs to be.
So you really don’t need to be lower than about 30 to even 40 or 50 grams of net carbs in a day. And it’s pretty easy to still stay at those numbers eating a little bit more berries. Eating some other types of veggies, not just green leafy veggies. Having some avocado, etc. And for somebody who is active in a class like Orange Theory, I think your regular daily intake being a little bit higher, you’ll find that you are still in ketosis. So there’s really not a reason to restrict to that level.
That number; it’s somewhat arbitrary. In fact, it’s very arbitrary because you could be eating twice as many carbs as you are and still find that you feel just as good. And from my perspective; the same way I have this perspective on everything. It’s a little bit of a “what can I get away with” situation. What’s the highest number of carbohydrates that I can eat that I feel good? I feel balanced. My blood sugar doesn’t feel crazy. I’m not craving anything. And, also, I’m getting the nutrients that I want to get. My digestion is good. And I’m not having these other potential effects that I don’t need. These negative effects. That don’t really need to be there, because I could be getting the positive effects without the negative.
So, that’s one thing. I think you could potentially increase the carbs that you're eating. The other thing I would say is, on days that you do a class like Orange Theory, which as far as I know it’s a high intensity interval training class. You could be taking in a little bit more carbohydrate around your workout. Some people really talk about doing it before. I personally feel best doing it after the workout. Because I feel like my body is really primed for it. It’s going to store a little bit of that, and the rest of whatever the days are and not having more.
So this doesn’t mean you're eating 100 grams of carbs right after the workout. But it might mean that the way you plan your day is; let’s just say you're going to go to your Orange Theory class at 5 p.m. Your breakfast and lunch are pretty low carb. Then you have your class. And then after it, you do have more carbs. Maybe even 30, 40, 50 grams. It doesn’t have to be that much. But if you had zero carbs all day, which is pretty easy to do. Let’s say you have bacon, eggs, and sauerkraut for breakfast with some leafy greens. Then you have a big salad with salad dressing, maybe some seeds and some protein. You're still right there; you're at 5 grams of carbs for the day. This is a really, really low-carb approach. Whether or not you were trying hard for it to be.
So, post workout, for me a really good example is I’ll have two Siete tortillas with my dinner. So instead of tacos wrapped in lettuce, I’ll actually have two of those tortillas. And it’s going to add up to about 25 grams of carbs. It’s not a ton, but it actually makes me feel really good right after a workout.
So that’s something to consider. The other thing you're experiencing with your heart rate not feeling totally right is probably an effect of an electrolyte imbalance. And personally, I think there are a couple of things you can do to approach this. One is actually eating those carbs after the workout. That’s going to assist in that electrolyte imbalance not happening. Two would be that you plan your keto diet a little bit better in terms of getting your electrolytes in.
So, magnesium; leafy greens are rich in magnesium. That’s a great source. Nuts and seeds. All different kids of vegetables. You want to make sure you're getting sodium, so salting your food. I like using sea salt, I think that’s a good approach. If you're eating bacon or any other types of cure meats, you’re probably getting enough sodium. Getting potassium; we’re not eating things like bananas and potatoes, so avocado is a great source of potassium. And if you're not able to eat avocado, do a quick search online and see if there are some other courses of potassium that will work for you.
And calcium is also important to make sure that you're getting it. If you're not eating dairy; which, obviously, dairy is a keto-friendly food. You can get calcium in other ways. It is a little bit tricky to try and get from leafy greens if we’re having some mineral absorption inhibited by phytic acid or other antinutrients. But sardines that have the bones in them. Literally, everything we’ve talked about with calcium on the paleo diet for years. If you can’t do dairy, that’s what you’ll do. Sesame seeds are a good source of calcium, as well.
So electrolytes could really help you. Now, that’s not true for everyone. For some people, taking an electrolyte supplement does not feel good. My husband, for example, we eat a lot of electrolytes in the food that we eat every single day. He started to take a little bit of a supplement, and he said; actually I feel like my heart is racing more when I take that. And it was kind of weird. I feel like he said his heart was racing? I think that’s what he said. Maybe he can edit in his response. {laughs}
But, just recognize that you could be having this electrolyte imbalance, and it doesn’t mean you have to take electrolytes. It would mean getting those minerals from your food, and also perhaps just eating a little bit more carbs on those days. And I honestly believe that you will still feel all of the great benefits of keto if you're punctuating the way that you do have additional carbs around your exercise.
And I talk about this in Keto Quick Start. So you can get more information on it. Lots of folks; I know Leanne Vogel talks about this. I know my friend Beth, from Tasty Yummy. She and I are going to do an episode about this whole practical approach to keto.
The only reason I didn’t call the new book Practical Keto is it’s not going to be a 500-page tomb with 11-14 meal plans. I just didn’t want to set that standard of; it’s going to be just like Practical Paleo, but for keto. Because the two approaches are totally different in terms of what we’re looking to do. But you will get a really practical approach.
I think the thing that people forget about eating keto is; the most important think to staying in ketosis that your personal blood glucose level; or glucose intake is in a certain place that your body decides; ok, this is low enough for me to shift over to burning ketones for fuel. It’s just not the same low level for everyone. And if your active and exercising, chances are you can eat more carbs and still be in ketosis. I just don’t want people who are active to think; I can only eat 20 grams of carbs. That’s just a BS flat out lie. It’s not the case for everyone.
Anyway, there is a great article that I would recommend. Circling back to the fast glucose being higher. Dietdoctor.com. We’ll link to it in the show notes. But it’s dietdoctor.com/low-carb-fasting-blood-glucose-higher. There are hyphens between each word. But if you Google diet doctor, high fasting glucose, you’ll probably find the article. And I think that you’ll find that really helpful.
There’s a lot of information in that article about this exact situation. And hopefully, the rest of my tips and advice on just feeling a little bit better. If she says that she does feel great, but I really want you to look at optimizing this in a way that doesn’t make you feel like “I can only eat 30 grams of net carbs a day.” That’s just super, super low and it’s not totally necessary.
Liz Wolfe: I eat a lot of carbs. And I ran out of carbs on my workout today in the Airdyne.
Diane Sanfilippo: How did that feel?
Liz Wolfe: I felt terrible. {laughs} It was just momentary, but man. Some of the high intensity stuff. You’ve got to strike that balance when you're doing the keto thing it seems like.
Diane Sanfilippo: You do. And you don’t have to be eating tons of carbs all the time, but you also don’t need to be; I don’t know. It’s just trying to add a little bit more, especially around the workouts, I think is a good idea. Because the thing is; we are burning fat more naturally all the time when we’re just not eating tons of carbs. But it is nice to have that carbohydrate reserve if your body wants to tap into it for this glycogen dependent activity. Which is high intensity interval training.
So I just think there’s confusion around this idea that if you eat any carbs, you won’t be able to burn fat. And I keep talking about that on the show, because I’m like; when did people somehow believe that your body wouldn’t be able to burn fat if they’re eating carbs?
Liz Wolfe: It’s the natural all or thing instinct that people have. If one thing is true, the other can’t be true.
Diane Sanfilippo: Yeah. It’s like; you know what I think is a great analogy? And I don’t know how electric cars work. But I think I should learn. I almost think it’s like an electric car that also sometimes runs on gas.
Liz Wolfe: A hybrid car.
Diane Sanfilippo: Sorry. Yeah.
Liz Wolfe: Are you talking about hybrid cars? I thought you were talking about hybrid animals.
Diane Sanfilippo: {laughs} What is that?
Liz Wolfe: It’s from I love you man.
Diane Sanfilippo: Oh.
Liz Wolfe: It’s bad for the whole world! Are you talking about hybrid cars? I thought you were talking about hybrid animals.
Diane Sanfilippo: Oh. A listener told me somewhere, I think she had to go watch Mean Girls, and after she did the whole podcast for the last 7 years made sense to her. {laughs}
Liz Wolfe: Broke it open for her.
Diane Sanfilippo: I didn’t know what you were talking about for 7 years. Something like that. Anyway. I think there’s confusion around that. And if you are someone who eats keto, but you also sometimes have carbs, I think then people feel like they won’t be in ketosis. But you're forgetting that during the day, your body is actually not looking for glycogen to fuel you just walking around. Walking around, gardening, typing at your desk. These are activities that are fat fueled.
Of course, if you have way too much carbohydrate going on for the type of activity you're doing all the time, you’ll know how that feels. And that’s a different situation. But we are able to tap into both. But being primed for ketosis does not mean that if you ever eat carbohydrates, you can’t get back into ketosis. I just think there’s a lot of confusion around that. So I will end it there. Let’s move on. But it’s a good question.
4. Safety of smoked seafood [32:41]
Liz Wolfe: This will be quick. This is from Mary. “Hi ladies! I’ve been trying to increase seafood consumption for me and my family, including a baby and a toddler, and I’m trying to improve my convenient options repertoire for nutrient dense choices. I recently discovered canned, smoked oysters. When I mentioned this to my mom, she commented that eating smoked foods frequently isn’t really healthy. Then of course I went down an internet rabbit hold of carcinogenic concerns. I wonder what your take is on this. I suspect, like many things, it’s a tradeoff. Should I limit smoked seafood consumption? Are the nutrient benefits still worth it? Are smoked oysters, salmon, and mussels safe for my kids if sourced well? I’m also interested in your thoughts on processed meat in general. Is there a downside to bacon and sausage if it’s from a good source? Thanks so much. I love your show. Thanks for all the great info you provide in such an open minded and approachable format.”
So, my thoughts on this is first of all, I think there is probably a difference between liquid smoke and what happens to meat that you're smoking where you get that kind of crust on it, right? Those have some carcinogenic compounds that are generated through that cooking and the application of heat to proteins. So I think there’s a difference there.
But at the same time, I also think it’s probably that trade off that you're talking about. We had an interview with Randy from Vital Choice fairly recently who was talking about; is it better if you can only afford the salmon from Walmart, is it better to avoid it or to eat it and to get the benefits that you can get from it? And Randy, who to his credit sells wild-caught salmon, was basically like; eat the salmon from Walmart. Because the benefits outweigh the concerns.
And I would tend to think that was the case here. This comes at an interesting time, because my husband has been eating a tin of smoked oysters like every day. {laughs} And the other day, I was like; you know, it would be good for you to just alternate that with sardines, something else convenient. Some other kind of convenient canned food. Because when you get really into something, and you're eating it every single day. And it’s a particularly nutrient dense food; that can lead to some potential nutrient imbalances.
So in the same way I wouldn’t tell somebody to eat liver every single day, I probably wouldn’t tell someone to eat smoked oysters every single day. Sardines; probably fine. But some of these that have for example really high levels of vitamin A and iron or as is the case with oysters, I believe oysters have higher levels of copper. So you just want to make sure you're kind of striking a balance with all of these things.
One of the sources of oysters that I like to use are the canned boiled oysters. I don’t know why the word boiled just grosses me out. It just sounds blech. But boiled oysters. You could marinate those in Tabasco, or do something fun like that to add some flavor if you wanted to get some variation from the smoked oysters. Which I think would be a good idea. But my biggest concern, when people are ready to start eating these oysters is just to look for one that doesn’t have cottonseed oil or soybean oil. Because so many of them are canned in those funky industrial oils. And that’s no good. So, my thoughts. What are your thoughts Diane?
Diane Sanfilippo: Indeed. I’m with you. Look; 90% of the time, we’re in agreement on most of these things. Oysters are such a great nutrient dense food. I think they’re one of the; it’s so cheeseball to say this. But it’s one of the best healthy convenience foods to have in your bag. I remember whipping out a pack of oysters in the middle of a Starbucks one time. This was so many years ago. Because it was in the bottom of my purse, and you could keep a granola bar in your purse, or you could keep a small tin of oysters. And what you're going to get from that tin of oysters is so much better than the granola bar.
And look; as strange as it sounds, I think that that is, I think it’s worth going for that. I’m with you. I think the benefits outweigh the risk. You're getting tons of B vitamins. You're getting B12, iron, some magnesium, some calcium. I talked about some of these things. I think oysters are a great one for people who are eating keto for that reason. And you are getting a healthy source of all those nutrients.
The other thing that you might want to consider in talking about either smoked or cured meats; and this could be a huge rabbit hole and time commitment, but maybe not. I don’t know if they have a transcript or any time stamps anywhere. But about a week or so ago, Chris Kresser was on the Joe Rogan podcast. It was a live version, and he had a debate with this vegan, I don’t know if he’s a cardiologist. I hesitate to state what type of doctor he was. I’m not entirely sure, because I also felt like his arguments were extremely poor. They were just poorly founded, and everything he had to say, Chris was like; actually, that’s not what the study said.
Liz Wolfe: Oh, so good.
Diane Sanfilippo: It was pretty funny. I love that Chris Kresser was the paleo argument gladiator for us. Because it’s just, he is the nerdiest in the best possible way, and I love it. But he was talking about how yes, of course, fresh meats are going to be ideal compared to things like smoked and cured meats. However, in the context of a diet rich in tons of antioxidants. Which I think most of us would argue. We do eat plant-based diets. Even when we’re eating a fair amount of meat.
A huge salad with a portion of protein. Or some bacon, but in the context of a whole bunch of baby kale or arugula. When we’re taking in those potentially not perfect proteins, because they might be smoked or cured, in the context of a high antioxidant diet, that it mitigates some of the potential downsides. So, you know, I think this is the case also for those of us who are talking about keto, like myself. And you’ll see, in the book or wherever. If you don’t want the book that’s fine. You can just watch my Instagram.
But when you see what I’m eating; it’s tons of green stuff. It’s not just about brown and white and yellow food. Which to me is meat, eggs, cheese, and all of the fats, and not really focusing on tons of plants and looking at low glycemic, low-carb, high nutrient value plant foods. Which I think that’s kind of the common ground.
Years ago, we were a little bit down on some plant foods. But we were also talking to lots of folks who had a lot of digestive distress. And we were like; ok, lay off the kale if your gut health is really whacky and you feel like you can’t digest it. But I think when you come around to just trying to see what will best balance out everything, we’re pro-plants. So there you go.
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5. What you’re missing on Instagram [40:43]
Liz Wolfe: Alright, let’s talk about what you might have missed on Instagram.
Diane Sanfilippo: {laughs}
Liz Wolfe: My Instagram, on my stories, you might be missing my workouts with my trainer. Out of anything I’ve ever posted, including my adorable daughter {laughs}, this what I’ve gotten the most feedback on. People are really enjoying watching what I’m doing with my trainer at the gym a couple of times a week. So, come check it out, or look at the highlight for workouts.
Diane Sanfilippo: I’m enjoying it.
Liz Wolfe: Thanks.
Diane Sanfilippo: It’s definitely motivating me. And makes me jealous at the same time. I’m like; why is she in the gym at this hour? I don’t want to be working. I want to be at the gym! {laughs}
Liz Wolfe: Go to the gym, dude.
Diane Sanfilippo: I know. My appointments are later in the day. Maybe after the book they’ll be earlier. But my trainer doesn’t seem to have tons of morning appointments open. But that totally motivated me. I talked about it weeks ago. So I like it. I’m looking at this on you just posted of pullups. I like how you strategically cropped it. Because I saw there was a band in that. {laughs}
Liz Wolfe: I did not! I cropped it so you could see both the band and the top of my head. Because it looks weird when my head’s not in it.
Diane Sanfilippo: I see it.
Liz Wolfe: Yeah.
Diane Sanfilippo: But you look jacked. Which, I love that.
Liz Wolfe: My back is really looking strong. And the way; it’s crazy because I have a video somewhere of how my back muscles were working at the beginning, and they were not. My shoulder blades were flared out all the time. I could not pull something. I don’t get to see my back a lot. So it’s cool to see these videos and be like; wow, look at how all my muscle groups are working together. It’s pretty cool.
Diane Sanfilippo: I love it. So on my Instagram, which I think most people are probably, hopefully, following along. And hey you guys; if haven’t told your friends to come follow us both on Instagram, can you tell your friends?
I have been challenging myself to share more. I mean, motivational quotes. I don’t know. I hesitate to call them a quote, if it’s just something I’m thinking. But in an effort to move forward with the type of content that I’m sharing in a direction that feels more authentic to me. Which will always have some grounding in food, because I just love food. I love to eat. I love to make it pretty. There will always be a lot of that.
But, I have challenged myself to basically every other thing I post pretty much is going to be some kind of quote with what I’m thinking about. And some kind of reflection. Whether it’s self-reflection. Whether it’s something I’m seeing out in the community of you all. Something I’m seeing amongst peers. Anything I’m recognizing or noticing as a pattern that’s either positive or not and kind of ways to move through the world for self-improvement and personal development. So that’s kind of what’s happening on my feed.
Stay tuned for notes on that. Because with my upcoming book tour, I don’t know if I’ll be able to do it in every city. But my plan is to also host some, maybe 3-hour workshops that go either the day before or the day after. I’m not exactly sure. That are personal development/professional development oriented. It won’t be a marketing conversation. But personal development is professional development. So stay tuned for details on that. If you are love those quotes, then I think you will love what I’m planning to do with these workshops.
Liz Wolfe: Alright, that’s it for this week then. You can find me, Liz, at http://realfoodliz.com/ and you can find Diane at http://dianesanfilippo.com. Join our email lists for free goodies and updates that you don’t find anywhere else on our website or on the podcast. While you’re on the internet, leave us an iTunes review. See you next week.
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