Podcast Episode #140: Binge Eating Repercussions, Thoughts on Yoli, Broth Won’t Gel, Thyroid Health & SIBO Diet

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Topics:
1. Liz’s updates [3:39] 2. Diane’s updates [7:45] 3. Medical repercussions of binge eating [15:25] 4. Thoughts on Yoli [22:49] 5. Can I supplement my broth to help it gel? [32:01] 6. Hypothyroidism and the meal plan in Practical Paleo for thyroid health [37:29] 7. Supplementation for excellent pooping [42:04] 8. SIBO diet questions [45:29]

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Liz Wolfe: Hey everyone! Welcome to episode 140 of the Balanced Bites podcast. I’m Liz; hey! That’s Diane.

Diane Sanfilippo: Hey.

Liz Wolfe: {laughs} Thanks for listening today everyone. Our sponsors: Pete’s Paleo, bringing fine dining to your cave. If you’d like to make eating paleo a little easier on yourself, checkout Pete’s meal plans. Delicious, great for those nights when you’re on the run, out of time, or you just need really delicious food fast.

Diane Sanfilippo: I’m going to cut you off on this one.

Liz Wolfe: Ok.

Diane Sanfilippo: Because…

Liz Wolfe: Well, that started early. {laughs}

Diane Sanfilippo: {laughs} I’m not sure what our offer is this week. We may have a new offer for folks. We record our podcasts a little bit ahead of when they air.

Liz Wolfe: Mm-hmm.

Diane Sanfilippo: Like, a minute before they air. So, check out the blog post on BalancedBites.com for the coupon code for that, because we may actually have a new one that’s a discount on a meal plan. So, anyway.

Liz Wolfe: Good one.

Diane Sanfilippo: Yeah.

Liz Wolfe: Alright, next up. Chameleon Cold-Brew, available at lots of grocery stores nationwide. Check out their website for a store locator, or do as we do and stock up whenever you can, and drink it all like it’s water.

Diane Sanfilippo: {laughs}

Liz Wolfe: Isn’t that what you do?

Diane Sanfilippo: It’s just caffeinated water, right?

Liz Wolfe: Right, exactly. Chameleon Cold Brew is organic, fair trade, smooth and rich. We loved it iced, warmed up, black with grass-fed butter, even with coconut milk. Check the website again for stores. And sit tight, because I’m not sure that they’re doing online ordering right now, but it is in many, many more stores than it used to be in, and chances are you can find it locally. And finally, our newest sponsor, Rickaroons. These macaroons are made of high quality ingredients, like coconut, dark chocolate, cacao nibs, and almond butter. They taste amazing, even though Diane can’t eat them because she doesn’t eat nuts. {laughs} They are perfect to keep on hand when you’re on the go and need a quick bite, or for like a great post workout snack. So check them out at Rickaroons.com and get 15% off your order with the code PODCAST.

Diane Sanfilippo: Yes. I actually did get to try them before my nut allergy sort of …

Liz Wolfe: Manifested.

Diane Sanfilippo: Exploded. Yeah. And they were ridiculous; like, really, really good. So I’m actually kind of upset about it. {laughs}

Liz Wolfe: It’s all in your head, Diane.

Diane Sanfilippo: Food allergies like this, like a nut allergy, it’s definitely worse to have developed as an adult, because I know how delicious hazelnuts are, for example. You know what I mean?

Liz Wolfe: Yeah.

Diane Sanfilippo: Like, if I never knew how delicious it was I think it would be a lot easier. But I can’t eat any of that, or strawberries. That stinks.

Liz Wolfe: Can’t miss what you don’t already know you really like.

Diane Sanfilippo: Yeah. So anyway.

Liz Wolfe: I’m with you.

1. Liz’s updates [3:39]

Diane Sanfilippo: What’s new with you? {laughs}

Liz Wolfe: {laughs} So, what’s new with you?

Diane Sanfilippo: ‘Sup with you?

Liz Wolfe: What’s up with you? So, this is going to air on the 22nd. On June 1st I am doing my Kansas City Eat the Yolks book signing and Q&A.

Diane Sanfilippo: Woot, woot!

Liz Wolfe: Whoop, whoop!

Diane Sanfilippo: When’s that going to be?

Liz Wolfe: That is June 1st, I believe at 1:30 p.m. at Coach Rut’s gym, Bootcamp Fitness Kansas City. It’s where it all started. This is my big one. This is the one that I’m so excited about to do in my home town where everything got started for me. So please, please, please try and come. If you’re within a several-hour radius, this is the Midwest, we all can drive, we all drive, all the time.

Diane Sanfilippo: Yeah, just listen to the podcast on your way to and from. No big deal.

Liz Wolfe: Exactly. And I’ll be polling to see who actually did that. Because we are steadily building this farm, it’s going to be harder and harder for me to even do events near me. We just added our pigs, finally. I’ve got a little story about that. But we’re getting our cows pretty soon. So if you can come, please, please come to this one, the one in Kansas City. Go to RealFoodLiz.com, there’s a link in the sidebar to the signup page. It’s totally free, all you need to do is RSVP so we can make sure we don’t max out the space and the fire department doesn’t come and tell me I’m fired. Ha ha ha ha.

Diane Sanfilippo: Ah-ha-ha-ha.

Liz Wolfe: To tell me to reduce the size, and we’ll just have to have people wait outside. I’m just kidding, we wouldn’t do that. But anyway, come to the Kansas City Eat the Yolks book signing. It’s going to be really fun. The other news is, we finally got our pigs happily installed on our property. We were supposed to get them a long time ago, so long ago that I actually went ahead and put on my book cover that I have a crew of pasture-raised goats, chickens, and pigs. But, before we ended up getting them we had a cold snap, and the piglets I guess weren’t doing all that well, and so the guy that we were getting them from said, you know, wait for this next litter that’s coming in the spring and I’ll get you all set up at half the price. {laughs} So who can; I’m stingy. Who can decline that? So anyway, we finally went out and picked up our piglets, and they are exactly what you would think they would be. They are really funny, kind of loud, and they squeal and snort like crazy. It’s really cute. So, we now have bacon living here.

Diane Sanfilippo: {laughing}

Liz Wolfe: We have four-legged bacon. They are large black hogs, which is a heritage breed. I guess they’re considered an endangered breed. But we’ve got some friends, actually at Fab Ferments, some of my favorite folks that do some different fermented foods and kombucha, they’ve got large blacks so they’ve helped me out a little bit. But they literally are, just the breed is called large black. They’re large, and they’re black, and they have these giant ears that flop over their faces to the point that I cannot make eye contact with them, and it is really bugging me! But apparently these are some of the best pigs to raise, you know, almost completely on pasture. We’re still figuring out how and if we need to supplement with any kind of non-GMO, organic, etc. type of feed, but at this point, they are just chowing happily on grass and on the different stuff that is growing on our back acreage, and it’s going to be awesome!

Diane Sanfilippo: Can you actually feed these pigs table scraps, kind of like the stuff that you would compost? Is that legit?

Liz Wolfe: Yeah, and we are. And I talk about that in Eat the Yolks a little bit, how pigs used to kind of be, literally, the piggy bank for the homestead.

Diane Sanfilippo: Right.

Liz Wolfe: So all of your waste, at least not the pig waste, not the pork scraps, but your waste can go to these pigs and they turn it into bacon. It’s really kind of a lovely, part of a more closed system.

Diane Sanfilippo: It’s so perfect.

Liz Wolfe: So, yeah, we’ve been giving them all of our fruit and veggies scraps, and our meat scraps, non-pork meat scraps, and of course we give the pork meat scraps to the chickens and to this point, it’s going really, really well. So we’ve got pigs. Wo-hoo!

Diane Sanfilippo: Wo-hoo!

2. Diane’s updates [7:45]

Diane Sanfilippo: Uh, what’s up? {sighs} Let’s see. Well, I sent out the SIBO guide to folks who were on the emailing list, so if you didn’t get that, I think we’re going to have a way, each week I’ll probably be resending a link somewhere in the email, so if you sign up but you missed something that you previously saw that I was sending out, there will always be a link back to that somehow. So, I know I’ve been getting really good feedback on the guide, and we have a question today we’re going to tackles that talks about some of the content in that book. But it’s about 50 pages, and it’s covering all kinds of information about, like what is SIBO, how do know if you have it, what should you do about it. One-page guides, recipes, all that good stuff, and also transcript of the interview that I did, which it is also on the website, but I wanted to give it to folks all in one place. I know a lot of people are downloading it, reading it on their iPad, that kind of thing. So, it’s like having this whole little digestion eBook, and super nerdy, but really very informative. Tons of just practical information and you know, I want to remind everybody that if you feel like this is something that you’re dealing with, I do recommend that you find a practitioner to work with one-on-one. The guide does not take the place of a naturopath or a functional medicine practitioner. It’s just to give you more information so that you’re armed and educated. So, there’s that. What else? While this podcast is airing, I’m on a boat. {laughs}

Liz Wolfe: Oh my goodness.

Diane Sanfilippo: I will actually be on the low carb cruise again this year.

Liz Wolfe: Do you have a nautical themed pashmina afghan?

Diane Sanfilippo: I do, yeah. Like 3.

Liz Wolfe: Great. Perfect.

Diane Sanfilippo: {laughs} I’m not speaking this year, but I will be attending, and yeah. I don’t know. It’s going to be a good time. I basically go to kind of hang out with the folks who are on the trip each year, and see everyone. It’s a good time, and I’m in much need of a break, because for the last about week straight now and a week straight a couple of weeks ago, I’ve been working on photographs for the upcoming cookbook, Mediterranean Paleo Cooking, which I’m helping to collaborate a bit on with my friend, Caitlin Weeks, and her husband Nabil, who is a trained chef, and he is also from Algeria. So, really amazing traditional Mediterranean recipes. The flavors are ridiculous. Things I never have cooked before, and really easy stuff. So, it’s Nabil’s traditional family recipes, with the twist of the fact that he’s a trained chef on the recipes, but Caitlin is also executing a large portion of them, so it’s kind of proof that anybody can actually make these dishes, which I think is really cool. So, anyway, I don’t know, just having a really good time doing that. And I don’t know what else to tell people. Check out my Instagram feed, and Facebook and all that good stuff for some of the photos that we’ve been working on here. I posted a photo the other day, and like 200 people out of 100-something thousand saw it. So, that was on Facebook, so come follow me on Instagram. Instagram is more fun.

Liz Wolfe: I will still be updating Facebook, just because I think it’s an important component.

Diane Sanfilippo: Yeah.

Liz Wolfe: However, just in the last two weeks, my reach has absolutely tanked. And it stinks, because I’m giving away a bunch of free stuff at Good Food for Bad Cooks and people just aren’t seeing it. So, I think in every podcast from now on we’ll put just the links right there in the podcast post to our email lists.

Diane Sanfilippo: Yeah.

Liz Wolfe: So if you’re not on them, you can sign up. And every single week, and I don’t know, are you doing weekly or biweekly?

Diane Sanfilippo: I pretty much do weekly.

Liz Wolfe: Ok.

Diane Sanfilippo: I’m going to figure out what’s going to happen going forward. I might actually put out a survey at some point in the next couple of weeks or couple of months here and kind of figure out what folks are really finding as the most effective way for me to reach them.

Liz Wolfe: Mm-hmm.

Diane Sanfilippo: But I don’t know.

Liz Wolfe: No, you tell them what the most effective way to reach them is.

Diane Sanfilippo: {laughs}

Liz Wolfe: And it is via email. {laughs} So, yeah, sign up for those lists, and we’re going to keep reminding folks to do that. Because that’s where you’re not going to miss anything.

Diane Sanfilippo: Yeah.

Liz Wolfe: And we’ll just aggregate everything, plus extra content that only goes out via email. So sign up.

Diane Sanfilippo: Here’s an idea too, something that I did recently. I have, you know, probably between 5 and 10 email lists that I am on that I really look forward to getting, that I love reading, and you know when they hit my inbox I’m not deleting them or skipping over them, I’m saving them for when I’m ready to kind of sit down and take them in. So definitely unsubscribe from lots of things that you don’t really read.

Liz Wolfe: Mm-hmm.

Diane Sanfilippo: And if you don’t, you know, if you listen to the podcast and you think you’re getting all the information, you’re kind of not. Somebody unsubscribed from the list, was like, well I see it all on Facebook. I’m like, actually you don’t. But, I want to make sure that if you want the information that you’re getting it. And if you don’t want it, feel free to unsubscribe.

Liz Wolfe: Yeah.

Diane Sanfilippo: But what I was going to say is, unsubscribe from all the other things that you actually don’t want to get. It will really help lighten the load. We totally understand what it’s like to have a million emails, but my other recommendation is, especially if you use Gmail, because that’s what I use, to create filters. And just filter those messages so you’re like, read this later this week, or important stuff that you want to check out, and it just can kind of skip your inbox if you just feel like your inbox is beating you over the head like mine was. There were literally over 500 unread emails in my inbox, so yeah. It’s crazy {laughs}.

Liz Wolfe: It is crazy. And just a note, we don’t pay for Facebook. That’s not how that whole deal works. But we actually do pay a fee to host our email lists.

Diane Sanfilippo: Mm-hmm.

Liz Wolfe: So it’s something that we work really hard on to get out really great content via the email lists, so it’s like we want you on that list, but only if you’re reading. Only if you want to be there.

Diane Sanfilippo: Yeah.

Liz Wolfe: We want to give you that content. So, keep that in mind.

Diane Sanfilippo: Well, that’s the other thing, too. Actually, folks who may have been on the list who haven’t opened an email in like 3 months, they kind of are getting kicked off my list. {laughs}

Liz Wolfe: {laughs} Kick ‘em out, kick ‘em out, waaaay out!

Diane Sanfilippo: Well, so if you’re like, well I signed up for that some time last year. I’ve never opened one of your emails; you’re probably not going to be on the list anymore. It’s just because it’s actually really expensive to keep more people on there. One other thing I was going to say, we’ve just been like, {laughs} griping about reaching our people here, but it is important, and we have a lot of really loyal podcast listeners, and we’re so grateful for all of you, and we know that you guys actually do get a lot of our information, so thanks for being here. I wanted to give you a heads up about the next cool thing that’s going to be coming out to my subscribers only, and that is, I think I’ve got 5 right now, and there will be more in the future, grocery lists for some of your favorite stores. So, Trader Joe’s, Whole Foods, Costco, National Grocer’s, and Sprouts I think are the first 5. So really cool, comprehensive lists, stuff that you can print out and take to the store. You’ll probably find products you never even knew they had just because we’re giving you the heads up about what these stores are carrying. That’s great. So, those are going to be really fun, and very useful.

Liz Wolfe: It’s because we like to spend 6 hours walking around the grocery store just looking at stuff.

Diane Sanfilippo: I window shop in the grocery store {laughs}

Liz Wolfe: I do too. Just read labels, put it back. “Can I help you ma’am?” Nope.

Diane Sanfilippo: No, I’m ok. I’m good.

Liz Wolfe: Just reading. Alright, so there’s a little education on how the internet works and what’s coming up. Shall we do; this is going to be a bit of a shortened podcast today by a few minutes, so should we get started?

Diane Sanfilippo: Indeed.

3. Medical repercussions of binge eating [15:25]

Liz Wolfe: Indeed. Alright. This one is from Sierra. “Hey ladies. I have been a listener from podcast numero uno.” Ugh, I’m sorry. {laughs} “And I absolutely love all the delicious information you two are putting out, almost as much as I love your hilarious banter. Almost.” I’m glad somebody thinks we’re funny. {laughs} “I know you guys have covered binge eating before, but my question is more on the medical repercussions of this disorder. I’ve been struggling with binge eating on and off for about 8 years, and I’m finally on the road to recovery, but I’m dealing with some pretty serious digestive issues that I can’t find the cure for. Every once in a while, 4-6 times per month, my stomach will just inflame, making it feel like someone is blowing up a balloon inside it, and it becomes firm, sort of what a pregnant stomach feels like. When this occurs, I also have mild acid reflux, and the inflamed stomach is super uncomfortable and embarrassing, and will last anywhere from 1-3 days. I eat a fairly clean paleo diet right now, and haven’t been able to tie it to any foods. One day I’ll eat a certain meal and feel great, and the next day I’ll eat that exact same meal, and bam, my stomach will inflame. So, I’m wondering if you know of any medical repercussions of having a binge eating disorder on the digestive intestinal system, and how to go about curing that. Thanks so much for all you do.” I’m guessing she means her gut becomes inflamed. Like, you know, when your stomach pooches out, and you’re like, oh my stomach, but that’s actually your intestines.

Diane Sanfilippo: Yeah.

Liz Wolfe: Yeah.

Diane Sanfilippo: I just had a couple of thoughts on this, and just want to remind people we are not eating disorder specialists, so take it with that caveat. I can imagine; so, part of what happens with what your digestive system is doing in terms of responding with, whether it’s stomach acid or bile salts or digestive enzymes, it’s sort of working on this averaging system where, if typically, here’s what you eat, typically here’s the response that your digestive system is offering up. Now of course, it’s going to react to different amounts of fat, amounts of protein and carbohydrate based on what you’re eating, but this is kind of like the example we give with folks who are eating a low-fat diet for a really long time, just haven’t asked their gallbladder to release bile for a really long time. Now, if over the course of 8 years, Sierra has had bouts of where she is eating a ton of food versus not, then sort of the cyclical habit that her body has gotten into in terms of responding to food, I’m guess that it’s either over or under responding when she’s eating what she might consider a normal quantity of food versus when she’s eating a lot of food. So, if you’re eating huge amounts and you're expecting your body to be able to break that down and digest it, it’s sort of confusing your body in not the best way. What we know about what tends to work the best for people is consistency over long periods of time. So, she’s asking about how to heal it or how to work on it, and I think it’s truthfully a matter of really being consistent and offering your body a moderate amount of food when you’re eating, and I don’t mean moderate as small, I just mean a standard amount of food and really getting that stuff under control. I know, Liz, you’re going to talk a little bit more to the emotional side of things because I think it’s really important to figure out why binge eating is happening. So, along the way, really just starting to be very consistent and not having those very large meals as often. Now, there’s always something you can do in terms of some supplementation to help with some of the acid reflux, or if it seems like the food is just not being digested, or if maybe you have a flood of too many digestive enzymes, that I’m not really sure about. We’ve talked a million times on the podcast, and it’s all in Practical Paleo about what to do to support digestion every step of the way, so I would just say go back and read that. Because if you’re dealing with something different, a different type of symptom, whether it’s the reflux or just the inflammation, see which supplementation might help with that at that time, but the truth is, I think that really to get this stuff to be under control and evened out and not happening, it’s a matter of offering your body something consistent, and that doesn’t have this extreme one side or the other. She doesn’t mention purging, but one thought I had when she talked about the binge eating, so this might not apply to Sierra, but perhaps somebody else listening. If you’re binge eating, and then you’re purging, you may be sending a signal to your body; hey, all this food is coming, produce stomach acid, digestive enzymes, and then you get rid of that food, your body still was in the process of producing that stomach acid, the digestive enzymes, that could lead to some other issues around reflux and lots of other issues downstream with too many digestive enzymes that you really didn’t need if the food now isn’t there. I think it’s really interesting to consider the ramifications of this eating disorder, on either side of that spectrum, whether or not it’s just the binge or it’s a binge or a purge. Anyway, that’s kind of my thought there. I’m not an expert, my hands are kind of up, you know, totally not an expert on that, but she asked, I’m answering.

Liz Wolfe: So, she said that she’s on the road to recovery, which is awesome. I’m hoping that has something to do with some emotional counseling, things like that, because this stuff doesn’t happen just because you really, really like food.

Diane Sanfilippo: Yeah.

Liz Wolfe: There’s definitely something else going on. For some people, there are actually physiological issues where they just can’t get full. Now, that’s really, really rare, but I think that the emotional part is so, so critical. And I also want to kind of tie together how your eating these meals with the emotional state. So, as you’re kind of becoming more and more aware of the circumstances around which you’re setting your meals and things like that, you might notice that you are eating the exact same meal one day, and getting one digestive reaction, and eating the exact same meal the next day, and getting an entirely different reaction. And that could be not so much about the food, but how you're eating that meal, what your emotional state is, whether you ate one day sitting down with taking some deep breaths, chewing it really, really well, that type of thing. And then the next day, maybe you eat it and you’re a little bit more scattered, you’re a little bit more on the run. I just find that folks who deal with some eating disorders are also, maybe a little bit more emotionally; I don’t want to say sensitive, but like a tuning fork, just kind of a little bit more emotional.

Diane Sanfilippo: Yeah.

Liz Wolfe: In certain ways. A little bit more tuned in metaphysically.

Diane Sanfilippo: Or absorbing some of the stress that other people are kind of putting out, too.

Liz Wolfe: Yeah, yeah. Totally. So, just observe how the counseling and everything like that may affect the emotional state, which may in turn affect how your digesting food. Just, you know, observe it. It could be an interesting thing. But, good on Sierra for seeking the help that she needs. That’s a tough one.

4. Thoughts on Yoli [22:49]

Liz Wolfe: Alright, next one. What do you think of Yoli? I totally thought that said YOLO at first, and I was like, oh my gosh, she watches the Kardashians too.

Diane Sanfilippo: {laughs}

Liz Wolfe: That’s not what it is. Alright, Cherise asks, “Dear Diane and Liz. I have been a devoted listener to your podcast almost since the beginning. You’ve validated much of what I knew to be the truth when I was diagnosed with leaky gut back in 2004.” That is an early diagnosis of leaky gut.

Diane Sanfilippo: Mm-hmm.

Liz Wolfe: Whoever her practitioner is, like, round of applause.

Diane Sanfilippo: {laughs}

Liz Wolfe: {laughs} “after years of denial, I have been 100% gluten free for almost 4 years now, and follow a diet somewhere between paleo and Weston A. Price. I would estimate 80/20 respectively. My question today is about the MLM business, Yoli. I have a very good friend who is engaged in it, and although I’m very happy that he’s not eating 3 large pizzas each day like he used to, I would like to know your take on the nutritional value of the shakes, pills, and the diet in general. He’s approached me several times about it because he knows that I’m ‘into good food’, but it just seems, I don’t know, like I should run the other way. FYI, I’m not interested in using it or selling it, I’m simply looking for information. I’ve done some research on it, but it seems everything online is sponsored, and there are no real testimonies or reviews. His business seems to be growing quickly, with a lot of people jumping on board. I’d just like to know if it’s legit as far as whole food nutrition; he says it is; or, if it’s snake oil. Thanks for all your hard work and dedication. “

Diane Sanfilippo: So. I clicked around the Yoli website, looked at a bunch of the products, and what they have in terms of ingredients and all of that. I just looks like a standard supplement line to me. A couple of the lines that we know of, like Standard Process, or Designs for Health, which are what I would consider practitioner lines, it looks pretty similar, and so it looks almost like more of a direct to consumer type of thing. I think whenever this whole MLM, so for people who don’t know what that is, it’s multi-level marketing, just means that somebody jumps in and starts selling it as a promoter kind of like the old Amway, I know some people are familiar with that. They start selling it, and then they recruit other people to sell it as well, and so those people beneath them are earning money for them. It’s like a big pyramid type thing. A pyramid scheme. That doesn’t necessarily mean the products aren’t legit, it just means that, I think the motivation for how and why it’s sold will change. And that’s obvious. You know, whenever money is involved, it changes things. And so, if you think about the perspective of, you go to your naturopath or nutrition consultant or whoever, and there are some supplements that they recommend, they probably buy them at a flat rate, X amount from the distributor, whether it’s Designs for Health, Standard Process, a bunch of these really well known companies. They sell it to you, yeah, they’re going to make a little bit of a mark up on it, most times. Sometimes they’re selling it directly, but usually they’re going to make a little bit of a mark up on it, which is totally legit and fair. But then that’s where it ends. So there’s no sort of exponential greed or exponential reason for them to just get super amped up, and like, ‘oh my gosh, this is the best thing in the world, it’s going to cure everything, and it’s this magical water’.

Liz Wolfe: {laughing}

Diane Sanfilippo: You know, anything to sell you on something because, especially if they sell you to come in and sell it also, it’s just exponential how much money they’ll earn. That element for me, the sort of get rich quick, that whole side of it makes me really uncomfortable. The actual supplements look fine. They just don’t look like anything special compared to anything else I’ve ever seen when someone is saying, ok, this one is going to support healthy metabolism. They’re all the same. Every supplement that I’ve seen that supports healthy metabolism usually has carnitine, it has B-vitamins.

Liz Wolfe: Everything you’d find in liver! {laughs}

Diane Sanfilippo: Yeah. There’s nothing really special about it from my perspective. Now, one thing they might do because they’re going to tell you, our special patented blend. If they add one different thing in, or change a quantity, or whatever, that’s they’re patented blend. If they do something that’s different, they can patent that. And so, that’s not an illegitimate statement on their part, it’s just that they’re changing what’s combined. Perhaps they’re running clinical trials on what it’s doing, and that’s all legit too, but in terms of, is it any better than everything else out there, I can’t really see why, and I can see how people could be that much more excited about it, because they stand to gain from it. The truth is, if you’re naturopath is making 5 or 10 bucks from the bottle of supplements that they sell you, I’d be willing to bet that they’re not selling it to you to make the 5 or 10 bucks. Like, yeah, that helps run their practice. They’re not making lots of money from lots of things, that’s just part of running a practice and being able to get you this high quality line that you can’t otherwise access necessarily because they are a practitioner and have gone through hours and years of study. So that’s the differentiator, from my perspective on that type of line versus this type of thing. We’ve seen a lot of these cropping up. We’ve seen a lot of different supplement lines come up. Shakeology is another example of this. We already talked about Shakeology on a past episode, and there are ingredients in their shakes that I just don’t care for that I wouldn’t want people eating or consuming. Not because they’re horrible, they’re just, eh, just not that exciting to me. But there’s nothing about it that is so revolutionary. It’s just that people are making a lot of money from it, so they’re going to talk about it. That’s just how it works, that’s how people operate. That’s my…

Liz Wolfe: Do you think there’s a way we could make this podcast into an MLM?

Diane Sanfilippo: Seriously.

Liz Wolfe: {laughing} We’re in the wrong business. I want to just add that I think it’s great when supplement companies actually do clinical trials on their products, but that does show a level of willingness to spend a little bit more on, I guess, business related stuff. But clinical trials are designed to collect a predetermined desired outcome from the company that commissions them.

Diane Sanfilippo: Right.

Liz Wolfe: So even take that with a grain of salt. Yeah.

Diane Sanfilippo: Totally. And just because that clinical trial proves that this supplement does something, it does not mean that another brand won’t also do the same thing.

Liz Wolfe: Right.

Diane Sanfilippo: It’s just it hasn’t been run through the same test, necessarily.

Liz Wolfe: Most comparably priced brands are all getting their ingredients from the exact same places in Nevada. {laughs}

Diane Sanfilippo: Right.

Liz Wolfe: Holding tanks in Nevada. And the other good thing about practitioner lines and going through a practitioner is, most of those practitioner lines, that kind of close their doors to just indiscriminate ordering, they’re actually providing ongoing consulting and counseling.

Diane Sanfilippo: Right.

Liz Wolfe: From doctors and naturopaths and things like that to the actual practitioner that’s using them. So when I was working with Biotics a little bit when my practice was open, I would call them and be like, hey, I’m just looking at this blood work that they’ve given me, I wanted to run some things by you, and it was really helpful. These MLM’s I would imagine aren’t able to do that.

Diane Sanfilippo: Yeah.

Liz Wolfe: Ok. Ready for the next one?

Diane Sanfilippo: And I think in the long term, too, there have been a bunch of products that are similar like this where, down the road we just find out there’s nothing so great about them.

Liz Wolfe: Mm-hmm.

Diane Sanfilippo: You know, and what was so great was just the excitement of the people who got behind it and created marketing for it and all of that.

Liz Wolfe: Yeah.

Diane Sanfilippo: And, you know, I mean that can be said about a lot of things so. Just, take it with a grain of salt.

Liz Wolfe: A lot of things. I get a lot of folks reaching out to me for kind of MLM type things that are skin care related. And I’ll try anything, but for the most part I have not been impressed at all by any of the MLMs or even the ones where you can become a rep and then you can have people below you. Which I think that’s pretty much MLM.

Diane Sanfilippo: That is MLM.

Liz Wolfe: And we act like it’s not. But I’ve tried Arbonne, I’ve tried a couple of different brands like that, and just… it’s expensive, and people get excited because they’re making money and this stuff doesn’t ruin their skin, but I just haven’t been all that excited about it. So just be wary.

Diane Sanfilippo: Yes. And I’m glad that your friend is also not eating 3 pizzas every day.

Liz Wolfe: Me too.

Diane Sanfilippo: And, you know, at the end of the day, that’s the big benefit. And if that’s what it’s helping people do, then I’m glad for that.

Liz Wolfe: {laughing}

Diane Sanfilippo: But in terms of, you know, should you get involved or whatever. I know that wasn’t really your question, but yet.

Liz Wolfe: They might be good, but they’re probably not magical unicorn sprinkles.

Diane Sanfilippo: Nope.

Liz Wolfe: Is what you’re saying.

Diane Sanfilippo: Exactly.

Liz Wolfe: Exactly.

Diane Sanfilippo: Ok.

5. Can I supplement my broth to help it gel? [32:01]

Liz Wolfe: Alright. This one we’ve tackled previously in the podcast, but we can always revisit these common questions. This one is from Jake. My broth doesn’t gel. “My bone broth from grass-fed cows produces only a modest amount of gelatin; nothing like the Jell-O-like amounts I see in other people’s photos of refrigerated broth. I’m considering adding some extra gelatin, Great Lakes collagen hydrolysate, but that might be out of balance with the assimilation cofactors that broth naturally contains, like glucosamine chondroitin and various minerals. Do you think my intuition is right? As far as getting bones from elsewhere, the shop at which I get the bones is the only drivable place within 50 miles where I can get knuckle bones as well as marrow bones. Shipping the bones would be prohibitively expensive. I’d welcome your thoughts on this matter.”

Liz Wolfe: I think it’s probably fine. I’ve thought about this a lot, like adding collagen or adding gelatin to the diet, you know. Because we talk about, we don’t love supplementation because a lot of times it’s out of balance with just kind of the normal synergistic way we get nutrients from food and how they work together. However, I think just as a general rule, we are not getting enough components from bones, enough gelatin, enough really kind of good fatty meats. We really do, even those of us who are not afraid of those types of things, the kind of odd bits, we’re probably still skewing towards lean meats more than maybe we should from a physiological perspective. Just for optimum physical health. So, I really don’t think there’s anything probably negative to supplementing with collage hydrolysate or gelatin. I think that’s probably totally good to go, so I wouldn’t worry about that too much. And I also wouldn’t worry too much about your broth not gelling. I think that the good stuff is probably still there. We’ve talked before about how heat affects the different proteins, and whether it breaks them down a little bit further. And it might, I don’t think we’ve actually gotten a really firm, absolute answer on that. I think it probably continues to break down a little bit as you continue to cook it, but who knows. But I really just wouldn’t worry about it. I think the good constituents are there, if you’re getting knuckle bones, you’re getting marrow bones and making broth from that, you’re probably fine. I like to experiment a little bit and do a short pressure cooker broth, and then I’ll do a long simmer, and then I’ll take that broth out and put that away, and then I’ll do an even longer simmer with the same bones, and just keep making it and making it and making it. Because as you go, you’re probably extracting different constituents from the bones and from the cartilage and all that stuff. So, just play with it. I really don’t think it’s that big of a deal. I think it’s all good to go. Do you agree, disagree?

Diane Sanfilippo: Yeah, do you think that just adding some more gelatin would put that out of balance, or?

Liz Wolfe: I really don’t. I think that, as an overall, all things considered, what we’re eating and what we actually need to help us digest, like the leaner meats and all of that stuff. I think it’s probably totally fine to get a little bit more of the gelatin to supplement with it. The collagen or the gelatin. And that’s another thing; sometimes when these questions come up and I know I’ve read these things or talked to Sarah Ballantyne, the paleo mom about it, I’m like, she does it, I’m sure it’s fine. {laughs} So I know that Sarah Ballantyne, the paleo mom who wrote The Paleo Approach, the autoimmune paleo bible, basically. She’s all about the extra gelatin, or I think she does some kind of beef plasma something or other, but we talked about it in a podcast with her.

Diane Sanfilippo: One thing, if he adds the Great Lakes version.

Liz Wolfe: Yeah.

Diane Sanfilippo: That he’s referring to, the hydrolysate.

Liz Wolfe: Hydrosylate.

Diane Sanfilippo: No, that’s not how it’s spelled.

Liz Wolfe: It totally is.

Diane Sanfilippo: Hydrolysate.

Liz Wolfe: Well, he spelled it wrong.

Diane Sanfilippo: No, I’m looking online.

Liz Wolfe: It’s spelled hydrolysate.

Diane Sanfilippo: Yeah.

Liz Wolfe: Well, they spelled it wrong, too.

Diane Sanfilippo: In multiple places.

Liz Wolfe: Well maybe I got it wrong.

Diane Sanfilippo: Yeah I think it might be.

Liz Wolfe: I’ve always said hydrosylate.

Diane Sanfilippo: Anyway. That one will not gel.

Liz Wolfe: Right.

Diane Sanfilippo: So that one is intended; that’s the green package. That one’s intended for a smoothie or something where you’re not looking for that gel to happen. You need to be looking for the red or orange label if you want it to add gel. And I believe the label is either orange if it’s not kosher, which means it’s probably from pig, and I think it’s more of a red color if it is kosher, which is I believe the beef gelatin. So, anyway, I just wanted to throw that out there, because he mentioned that specific type, and I was like, I’m pretty sure that’s not going to gel.

Liz Wolfe: Yeah.

Diane Sanfilippo: If you were trying to get it to do that.

Liz Wolfe: And the hydrolysate is basically just gelatin further broken down into its component parts.

Diane Sanfilippo: Correct.

Liz Wolfe: So. My friend Summer Innanen has seen some really, really, really, really good results from the collagen hydrolysate. So, FYI.

Diane Sanfilippo: Ok.

Liz Wolfe: Summer, from Summerthenutritionist.com.

Diane Sanfilippo: {laughs}

6. Hypothyroidism and the meal plan in Practical Paleo for thyroid health [37:29]

Liz Wolfe: Alright. Final question, and then you gots to go. Unless we get to the next one. Thyroid health meal plan in Practical Paleo and supplement for eliminations. Em asks, “this is a two-parter. One, I have hypothyroidism, but keep the symptoms in check with daily thyroid supplements, so my thyroid level is correct. Well, corrected. I see that Practical Paleo has a specific eating plan for conditions like hypothyroidism. Would I benefit from following that plan, given that my thyroid levels are corrected via medication, or is that plan only for folks who don’t supplement to fix their levels?”

Diane Sanfilippo: Should I talk on this one before you do the next one?

Liz Wolfe: Yeah.

Diane Sanfilippo: So, let me address this sort of backwards. The eating meal plan, whatever you want to call it in Practical Paleo for thyroid health, it’s not intended for people who don’t supplement to, she is saying “fix” their levels. It’s not that eating that way will balance your thyroid and regulate to the point where you won’t necessarily need to supplement with thyroid hormone. So, that was a whole bunch of negatives, like it won’t not do that.

Liz Wolfe: {laughs}

Diane Sanfilippo: Anyway. Let me re-explain. The 30-day meal plan for thyroid health in Practical Paleo was intended to naturally support your body and support your thyroid by removing things that may be irritating to it. So things like raw or fermented goitrogenic vegetables are not generally recommended. That’s written in there. Specific foods that will support thyroid health that have certain nutrients are listed. Diet and lifestyle recommendations which, from my perspective, when I was writing the meal plans, the diet and lifestyle recommendations kind of avoid, are almost the bigger bulk of what’s important to pay attention to with those meal plans than the exact 30 days of what to eat, and that may sound strange, but the 30 days of what to eat will vary a little bit from sort of a basic paleo approach, right, and some of the foods I just mentioned, but the overall diet and lifestyle together. The lifestyle component, exercise, what you’re doing, what you’re not doing. That stuff is even more important, and perhaps some of the supplementation that I recommend in there may be more important than whether or not you eat carrots or sweet potatoes or whichever foods you’re choosing. But maybe the overall, you know, making sure that you’re resting enough and that you’re not crushing yourself at the gym, all of those types of things. It’s not intended to be in place of either medical advice or treatment, or medication, which she calls it in this case. I don’t really think of thyroid hormone as medication, because I think of medication as something that is up or down regulating a normal body function, not attempting to rebalance it. So, what you’re doing with thyroid hormone when you’re prescribed thyroid hormone, it’s intended to rebalance your body. So, if your body cannot make thyroid hormone because part of your thyroid is damaged from the hypothyroidism, especially again if it is autoimmune, you need to get that hormone in so that your body comes back into homeostasis and into balance. I remind people about that all the time, and I really want to make sure that that’s clear.

Diane Sanfilippo: Now, if you’re thyroid is well-balanced, the meal plan in Practical Paleo still may be pretty effective and helpful for you. And again, that’s not necessarily, eat this way for the 30 days exactly. It’s more, read over what the recommendations are and really follow those recommendations, because hypothyroidism, it’s not a one-shot deal to balance what’s happening. That’s something that every single person I know with Hashimoto’s who’s taken thyroid hormone has had the change the dose over, whether it’s 6 months, over a year, it doesn’t remain static all the time for every person. Of course, there may be some people who take the same dose all the time for many years and feel fine with that, but chances are that’s not the case, and so supporting your body and your thyroid naturally the way that you’re living and eating, it’s always a good idea. So, it’s kind of a multi-factorial approach, and the meal plan can be helpful for anyone, is sort of the short answer, who is even concerned that thyroid health or hypothyroidism might run in their family. It can be completely effective and helpful for those types of folks, as well. Anyway, that’s the answer on the meal plan. And part 2.

7. Supplementation for excellent pooping [42:04]

Liz Wolfe: Part. “I started taking this supplement by Standard Process called Cholacol II. It contains bentonite, collinsonia, and bovine bile salts. If I take this stuff as directed, 4 tablets before each meal, I have super-star BMs, firm and no mess, up to twice a day. If I take it any less, the BMs go back to what they’ve always been for me, about every other day of varying consistency. What is it about Cholacol II that is creating this champion poop situation? Should I be concerned that the frequency drops without it?“ And I would say, it depends. Have you been taking Cholacol for like 2 years, and you are now relying on it, I guess as a crutch, and your superstar BMs depend on that supplement, I think maybe it would be time to explore a way to support. What I think it probably, it could be the bentonite that’s helping here, but it’s more likely to be the bile salts. But if you’ve been taking this supplement forever and ever and have become dependent on it, then it’s probably time to look at a different way to support your gallbladder, and probably also your liver since that’s kind of part and parcel to the health of your gallbladder. But if you are on one bottle, usually the rule of thumb, for me anyway, was between one and three bottles. So that would usually be between 30 days and 90 days to use this type of support, depending on the situation, and then kind of wean yourself off of it, because the idea is whatever is going on that we want to kind of kick start the gallbladder, kick start bile production, that type of thing. And with the bentonite, I’m not entirely sure. Depending on what situation you’re in, once you’re ready to try to maybe wean yourself off of them after maybe one to three months, you might want to look at taking bentonite separate from bile salts. I know Redmond I think has a supplemental clay that you can take. There are some things you need to be aware of when you’re taking that. Like, when you’re taking it, take it on an empty stomach, things like that. Because it can, I guess, chelate some nutrients, I guess that would be the right word. But taking that, seeing how you do, seeing how that affects the BMs, and then also with meals taking just straight bile salts, and seeing which one maybe is actually doing the job for you. It’d be interesting to know. So, if you haven’t been taking it all that long, I think keep with it between 1 and 3 months, and see if you can wean your way off of it, because the idea, again, is to kick start those digestive capacities that lead to superior poop, and hopefully maintain that over time on your own. Do you have any thoughts on that, Diane?

Diane Sanfilippo: No, I’m with you on that. I went back to look at her original message to see if there was any other information on how long she had been taking it, and there wasn’t so. I’m with you on that. I think, you know, if it’s helping to rebalance some things over the course of that one to three months, then that’s cool, and then I would try and isolate, what’s the one thing that’s really doing it for her.

Liz Wolfe: Yeah.

Diane Sanfilippo: Which is what you mentioned. So yeah, I think that’s good.

Liz Wolfe: Do you have time for this last one?

Diane Sanfilippo: I can do it super fast.

8. SIBO diet questions [45:29]

Liz Wolfe: Super, super fast. SIBO diet. Karen asks, “in regards to the SIBO recommended diet, is the diet to help heal the problem, or just to lessen the symptoms. Meaning, if I continue on the diet for a certain amount of time, will SIBO be healing, or just not being aggravated due to the lack of foods that make the issue worse. Also, how many drops of the oregano would you recommend taking daily? Also, what’s a good probiotic you would suggest? I’ve tried quite a few but would like to hear what you two are taking and your thoughts on that.”

Diane Sanfilippo: So, really short answer to this, to the first part of the question. The diet is not going to heal the infection. If you have small intestinal bacterial overgrowth, it’s an infection, it’s a problem with bacteria being in the small intestine when it shouldn’t be there, so just changing the food, I’m going to guess depending on the severity of it, if it’s not that severe, it’s very possible that changing your food could cause that to completely go away if you're not feeding the bacteria and they just basically die off. Now, I’m going to guess that in the majority of situations, it’s not going to actually cure anything. It will make you feel better in the meantime, because the symptoms will subside, but you do need to do something else to kill that infection. Typically, it involves some sort of antibacterial approach, whether that’s natural or pharmaceutical. And then, in terms of the oregano, I don’t have a specific dose for it. It depends on which brand you have and how you approach that. You can look in the Simplifying SIBO Guide for more details on that, as well as details on the probiotics.

Liz Wolfe: Are you taking a probiotic, D?

Diane Sanfilippo: There is one that Scott actually brought from his house. {laughs} I think it’s expired, and I was like, I’ll try it.

Liz Wolfe: {laughing} That always goes well, eating expired things.

Diane Sanfilippo: This was like, I had a sinus infection last week, which just irritates me to no end. Hold on one second.

Liz Wolfe: Maybe you have a deviated septum.

Diane Sanfilippo: So I took it, and I really did find, I only took it maybe twice over the course of a week, and I did find that it really helped my eliminations, which that was like, oh, ok. Maybe I’ll take this a couple of times a week when I remember it. We’ll see. I don’t generally take anything every day, so, except food. Every day.

Liz Wolfe: I believe that. Alright. In closing, that’s everything. We’ll be back next week with either a guest or more questions, we shall see. If you’ve been enjoying the podcast, please remember to subscribe to the podcast. Subscribe, subscribe, subscribe friends, and help us spread the word by leaving a review in iTunes. It may seem like a small thing, but it’s actually a very, very big thing. And there’s a joke in there somewhere. As always, you can find Diane at http://blog.balancedbites.com/, and you can find me at realfoodliz.com. Be sure to join our email lists, where we provide exclusive content to our subscribers that we don’t put anywhere else. And of course, follow us on Instagram to see what we’re eating and what my goats and pigs are doing. Thanks for listening.

Cheers! Diane & Liz