Podcast Episode #147: Losing friends on Paleo, help with waxy hair, stuck in a meal prep rut

Remember – If you're enjoying these podcasts, please leave us a review in iTunes. Thanks!

Topics:
1.  Diane’s updates [4:39]
2.  Liz’s updates [8:54]
3.  What to do if no-poo isn’t working?  [13:39]
4.  How to maintain a social life while making the paleo switch [22:26]
5.  Stuck in the chicken, broccoli, and coconut oil rut [34:03]
6.  Shortcuts and tips for cooking paleo when short on time [39:24]
7.  Diane’s kitchen tip [53:16]

[smart_track_player url=”http://traffic.libsyn.com/balancedbites/BB_Podcast_147.mp3″ title=”#147: Losing Friends on Paleo, Help with Waxy Hair, Stuck in Meal ” artist=”Diane Sanfilippo & Liz Wolfe ” color=”00aeef” social=”true” social_twitter=”true” social_facebook=”true” social_gplus=”true” ]

Links:

Click here to listen online

The episodes are currently available in iTunes, Stitcher & Blog Talk Radio. 

 

 

Show sponsors:

Liz Wolfe: Hey everyone! Welcome to episode 147 of the Balanced Bites podcast. I’m Liz, and I’m here with Diane, and let’s start with our sponsors. . First up, Pete’s Paleo, bringing fine dining to your cave. Make eating paleo a little easier on yourself by checking out Pete’s meal plans. They are great for times when you need real food fast. You may have heard that Pete’s Paleo is now offering 21-Day Sugar Detox friendly meals, which is amazing, because it will make your life that much easier on the 21-DSD. Check out Petespaleo.com for all the details on the new 21-DSD and other special diet-friendly meals. Definitely also check out their bacon, if I may throw in a little personal note.

Diane Sanfilippo: Word.

Liz Wolfe: It’s crazy good! Next up, Chameleon Cold-Brew. Their new ready to drink single serving bottles are hitting store shelves all over the place. They’ve got a black coffee, as well as vanilla and mocha, which are also both black coffee, but they’re just lightly sweetened with organic cane sugar. They’ll have three new flavors out coming in August, so stay tuned for details on that. I also love to keep their cute little bottles and put flowers, reeds, and things like that in them. Definitely fun to upcycle those. And, finally, a few new places to find Chameleon Cold Brew. I’m going to butcher some of these, but for New York people, Whole Foods, Khim’s Millennium market, Fairway Market, Westside Market, what did we say, Devices, or Deviches?

Diane Sanfilippo: {laughing} I have no idea.

Liz Wolfe: I don’t know in Westchester County, numerous bodegas, and tons of retailers being added daily. In Hawaii, check out Papaya’s and Down to Earth. In Atlanta, look for them at Earth Fair, Fred Meyer in the Pacific Northwest in addition to Whole Foods. And lots more retailers and regions every day. I know they’re at Super Target in at least 5 southwest states; Texas, Oklahoma, Colorado, Kansas, Los Angeles carries the concentrate, and the online store is back in action, but it does sell out quickly. So if you can identify a local retailer that has Chameleon Cold Brew, that’s probably the way to stock up without having to click refresh a million times until their stuff is back in stock. And, finally, we’re super excited about our newest sponsor, Splits59. It’s a high performance, high fashion active wear company that is based in LA, which we love. It’s American made, the folks behind Splits59 are really amazing people. We adore them. I am obsessed with them. Some people might know that. It’s kind of sad for me, though, because being at the homestead here, I can’t even wear cute yoga clothes anywhere, because I never leave. It makes me sad.

Diane Sanfilippo: Nobody sees you, you better post pictures.

Liz Wolfe: Maybe I should take more selfies.

Diane Sanfilippo: Yeah, you definitely should.

Liz Wolfe: I probably should. But anyway. I wear my Splits59.

Diane Sanfilippo: Can’t the goats take a picture for you? I mean, come on.

Liz Wolfe: Diane. Don’t that have cloven hoofs, isn’t that what they have?

Diane Sanfilippo: No opposable thumbs.

Liz Wolfe: They don’t have {laughs} opposable thumbs. Ugh. But, anyway. We love Splits59. They’ve generously offered our listeners 15% off any regularly priced merchandise with the promo code BALANCEDBITES, not case sensitive. That code is valid for any full priced items, but right now, and this airs on July 10th, 2014, be sure to check out Splits59.com because their big sale is going to be going on at the time this podcast airs. So check them out. Yes! Very cool.

Diane Sanfilippo: Whoo-hoo!

Liz Wolfe: Whew-hew. Diane, any updates?

1. Diane’s updates [4:39]

Diane Sanfilippo: Updates, updates. So, oh, yeah. I’m trying to manage the calendar and when this airs; so we’re airing this July 10th. We’re so sneaky, that we’re in the future right now.

Liz Wolfe: Mm-hmm.

Diane Sanfilippo: But, if you are interested in the 21-Day Sugar Detox, I have some really big, awesome, amazing stuff going on. A brand new roll out of the program. If you have the books, you will be excited about what’s coming, because you’ll get some special goodies and special offers. If you already have them, if you don’t already have them don’t worry about it. I will have a great opportunity and a way for you to get them. But a whole new online program is coming. So for those of you who loved having the online situation and place to log in and download all kinds of goodies and audio support files, and just so much more information. More details on things like, if you’re following the athletic performance modifications, pregnancy and breastfeeding, if you’re a pescatarian. So, lots more information and just really user friendly information, recipes, all that good stuff. So, just go to 21DaySugarDetox.com, or actually, I feel like you could probably just type 21DSD.com, I’m pretty sure I have that URL. And you will find a way to sign up to be notified when everything is available. I actually also have some really cool videos that will be coming out, probably very soon from when this episode airs. They are just a series of, I think 3 or 4 videos, just kind of teaching you some different stuff about why we crave sugar, common places where sugar hides. Different stuff like that. So, I think just some great, easily accessible information to help you kind of figure out this whole thing. And that’s it. So, I’m sure there will be a little link from my website about it, too. So, that’s pretty much it. I’m pretty excited about it.

Liz Wolfe: Good times.

Diane Sanfilippo: Yeah. I’m excited to get all of it back online, because I actually really love being able to update things for people, and give them lots more information all the time.

Liz Wolfe: Yes.

Diane Sanfilippo: I mean, you’ve seen that with Good Food for Bad Cooks.

Liz Wolfe: Yeah, that’s why we picked that model, because you can continuously deliver content. It’s not like you buy a book, and it’s a kind of one off shot at all the recipes.

Diane Sanfilippo: Totally. I try to put as much as I can into a book, but you’re just limited. I really wanted the Sugar Detox book to be portable, so it wasn’t going to be a 400 page book, because that’s just not practical for people. But, yeah, with the online thing, and people can print out PDFs, and just print out pages they want and all that good stuff. Yeah. So I’m excited.

Liz Wolfe: You’ve got the best of both worlds there.

Diane Sanfilippo: Be the best of both.

Liz Wolfe: I think it’s really awesome how you’ve kind of; I mean, I’ve never seen anybody do before what you’re doing with the 21-Day Sugar Detox, integrating all this online content with the books, and it’s just, I’m excited.

Diane Sanfilippo: Hooray!

Liz Wolfe: Blazing a trail.

Diane Sanfilippo: Yeah, I just really, you know, after the program was available online for so long, and then I published the books, I was like, you know I miss having that whole online thing. I miss having the capability of saying, hey guys, I added this cool thing. You guys can all go download it. It’s so much fun to kind of keep updating and keep making things better. It’s one of the things I love about the internet and what I’ve always loved about web design, nothing is static. You can constantly change it, you can fix things, whatever you want to do. So I’m excited to be able to do that again for people. And you know, remember, I touched on it briefly, but if you already have the book, or both books, or if you already have the online program, I have you guys all accounted for. I know that tons of our listeners and loyal readers and fans have all already purchased a lot of this stuff, so I have really amazing discounts and all that kind of stuff, so it’s not like you’re spending all over again.

Liz Wolfe: Yeah.

Diane Sanfilippo: I’m basically giving you all of the money back, practically, that you spent on a previous product. If you want the new one; you don’t have to get it to do the program, but it’s just more awesome content. So, there you go.

Liz Wolfe: Very cool.

Diane Sanfilippo: I can’t wait. I can’t wait!

2. Liz’s updates [8:54]

Liz Wolfe: Well, my update is little. Well, it’s not little, it’s like 6 feet long. And it’s called a snake in my chicken coop.

Diane Sanfilippo: {laughs}

Liz Wolfe: Homestead problems. Hashtag!

Diane Sanfilippo: Ticks, bedbugs, and snakes. Not that you had bedbugs, but I consider a tick to be as scary as a bedbug, or maybe not as scary.

Liz Wolfe: It’s like a giant bedbug.

Diane Sanfilippo: But now snakes? Ugh, what happened?

Liz Wolfe: Well, ok. So it’s like getting around towards the end of the day, and my husband and I were out just kind of putting everything away and doing the end of the day stuff. We hadn’t collected the eggs yet, so we went in, and his hand is like 2 inches away, and he goes, that’s a snake! Like, literally 2 inches away from this snake. He was like, it felt like a weird, his fingers felt a weird vibe. That’s what he said. He was like, I knew I wasn’t reaching for an egg. {laughs} It was this huge snake. And it’s just a black snake, it’s like a rat snake. So they’re actually, they’re good snakes. We do have some crazy stuff out here. I think we’ve got, I don’t know if it’s copperheads or cottonmouths, I don’t know. Something that’s had a band named after it. I’m just, I’m not sure. But this particular snake is not venomous, but it is a giant snake nonetheless, and it’s in our chicken coop. So basically, what these black rat snakes are supposed to do is control the rodent population. So they’re actually, you know, a good thing. Because we do give our chickens a handful of grain at the very end of the day, non-GMO, soy free, organic grain, because it’s just a nice treat. We give them that, we give them mealworms but mealworms get a little bit expensive, and it keeps them bonded to us, it keeps them coming back. So there’s grain in there, and any time you keep grain, you’re going to have rodents. So these black snakes are supposed to control the rodent population, but so far we have discovered it in the coop at least twice. So of course, both of us are like, reaching in with 10-foot poles and reaching in with shovels and rakes and stuff like that to try and get it out of the nesting box, and nothing worked, so basically we just tipped it over and ran screaming like little children from the chicken coop, and it just kind of slid out and under the chicken coop. Which was fine. It’s really lazy. I think by the time it’s in there, it eats a couple of eggs, and it’s just not moving. I think the next time we see it, we will probably just remove it. Not by hand, but we’ll probably just pull out the nesting box and tip it over. I don’t know.

Diane Sanfilippo: Yikes!

Liz Wolfe: Yeah. Apparently, they’re good snakes, and that’s fine, but it be a big snake. {laughs} It’s a huge snake. But it doesn’t bother the chickens; the chickens are too big. It just wants the eggs. Although I will say, everyone was saying the black snake is a good snake and don’t kill it, but my friend Quinn, who is from Midlothian, Virginia, and she knows stuff. She just knows stuff. You ever have a friend that just knows stuff? She just knows stuff, and I was talking to her on the phone the other day, and she goes. No, Liz. That is a lazy snake. It might be a good type of snake, but that particular snake is lazy. Because if you’ve got rodents, it should be off eating the rodents. But it has discovered that you have eggs in that chicken coop every single day, so it’s just posting up in the chicken coop, and it’s not doing its job. So, she was like, you’ve got to take its head off. And, we haven’t yet. But, I thought she made a valid point. We have a lazy snake on our hands.

Diane Sanfilippo: {laughs}

Liz Wolfe: {laughing}

Diane Sanfilippo: I’m totally freaked out about it.

Liz Wolfe: Well, you’re not planning on coming over anyway, so. {laughs} But you’re invited.

Diane Sanfilippo: I feel a lot of guilt and shame around my lack of desire to have a homestead.

Liz Wolfe: {laughing} You feel a lot of guilt and shame.

Diane Sanfilippo: I have no desire to do that. I will buy the stuff from whoever wants to do it, but totally, I feel like a city slicker, and I’m not really a city person, but maybe I kind of am.

Liz Wolfe: City slicker.

Diane Sanfilippo: What?

Liz Wolfe: You city slicker.

Diane Sanfilippo: It’s just crazy. I just, yeah. I don’t think I’m cut out for any of those things that require a nurturing tendencies.

Liz Wolfe: Well, I didn’t really think about it that way. And I’m not all that nurturing of a person.

Diane Sanfilippo: Apparently, you are! You’re keeping things alive over there! I couldn’t even grow chives!

Liz Wolfe: {laughing} That is kind of funny.

Diane Sanfilippo: It’s true!

Liz Wolfe: Those are actually really easy to grow. {laughing}

Diane Sanfilippo: See! The cat ate them, and I didn’t protect them.

Liz Wolfe: Oh man. Alright, well that’s all I got. Anything else before we get going?

Diane Sanfilippo: Nope.

3. What to do if no-poo isn’t working? [13:39]

Liz Wolfe: Cool. {laughs} Alright. Help with waxy hair. This is from Jackie. “I’ve been trying to use natural hair care for about 5 months or so, now, and my hair seems to be getting worse. I’ve tried no-poo, I’ve tried just using Dr. Bronner’s and homemade shampoos, and my hair is so waxy, yes waxy, not oil or dry or any of the typical results I hear about, that you cannot run a brush or comb through it, and it seems like I have such bad dandruff that I’m embarrassed to go out without a hat or a scarf on my head. I did not have these problems before going natural. I have long, thick, straight hair, and I’ve always gotten compliments from everywhere on how beautiful my hair is, so this is really hard for me to deal with, and I’m so close to giving up and going back to chemicals. Do you have any suggestions that I can try to use to see if I can somewhat manage this disaster on my head? Additional info. I’m strict paleo diet, trying to clear up acne issues, pilates 3 times a week, 8 hours of sleep every night, no supplements.” Well. I would like to say that there are many in between options between being a total hippie and using baking soda and apple cider vinegar and using industrial chemicals to wash your hair. And one of the brands I like, if budget is not a huge issue, is Just Natural Organic Care, and I think you can find that on Amazon. They have some shampoos that are kind of based around different herbal extracts and whatnot. Their conditioners, as well, are the same way, and they are really lovely. And a tiny bit goes a really, really long way. So you might pay 30 bucks for a big thing of shampoo, but it’s going to last you forever, and I can say that with full confidence, because I haven’t had a hair cut in like 6 years, so I have a lot of hair. So those things last forever and ever. For a really long time, I did no-poo, and I still go back and forth between no-poo and using the Just Natural stuff. I just have so many things that are sent to me that I want to try, and I’ve kind of gotten that routine down, where I can switch back and forth between using no-poo, which is just baking soda and apple cider vinegar, and using kind of the natural stuff that people send me to try out and the Just Natural stuff. And there are some brands that you can find at Whole Foods that are pretty affordable that don’t have, you know, hydrolyzed wheat protein, and methylpropyl, isobutylparaben and all that other crap that doesn’t need to be in there, that’s just filler to stretch out the amount of stuff these people can put in the bottles.

I do have a post at the Skintervention Guide website called, why isn’t no-poo working for you? So some people are just really, really, they want to make the no-poo routine work because it’s so, so budget friendly. I mean, there’s not a whole lot of things more affordable than using baking soda and apple cider vinegar to cleanse your hair. It’s something I did exclusively for at least 2 or more years. According to the people that wrote in last week, Diane, and were like, I’ve been listening to the podcast for at least 2 years. I have absolutely no concept of time. So I think it’s been at least 2 years, but it might have been more that I had done no-poo exclusively. Anyway, the post, why isn’t no poo working for you? It talks about things like, how hard your water is, the mineral content of your water, and maybe leaving the apple cider vinegar in too long, and things like that. Now, using just Dr. Bronner’s. I’m hoping if you’re just using Dr. Bronner’s that you’re also doing an apple cider vinegar rinse afterwards, because any soap is really alkaline. And you’re scalp is meant to be a little more acidic than that. So the whole point of using a vinegar rinse is to bring the scalp back to its natural level of acidity. So that’s really important. If you were doing Dr. Bronner’s, I think that’s probably a little bit harsh. I would add at least some coconut milk, or maybe a little bit extra coconut oil or olive oil just to make that lather a little more rich if you want to try that. But nobody needs to feel obligated to use all of the crunchy hippie methods, as if that’s the only way they can possibly be unnecessary chemical free. So, you can try all kinds of stuff. Don’t feel bad trying a natural brand shampoo. A lot of people I know like Morocco Method. I think, let’s see Tonja from Flame to Fork, or is it Claire? One or the other or both of them uses Morocco Method, and they love it. A ton of people like that brand. I didn’t have a whole lot of success with it, but you just have to find what works for you and your body chemistry. So, Morocco Method might be something to look into. Just Natural Organic Care could be good. Primal Life Organics has hair, basically it’s like a hair clay, which is great, works really well. I mean, there are a million different things that you could try. But don’t feel bad going back to the old stuff. I mean, in the end, shampoo and condition are only on your body for a short period of time. I think, probably in the grand scheme of things, I would say that the stuff you put on and leave on, like lotions, serums, facial moisturizers, deodorants, especially, things like that. Those are the things that I would really try to push through and find something natural that works. But if you absolutely have to go back to doing the Pantene Pro-V, just, I don’t know, hold your breath and don’t let it get in your mouth when you’re using, but don’t stress about it too much.

Diane Sanfilippo: I like to slurp up all of the drippings of shampoo.

Liz Wolfe: Yeah, yeah. Me too.

Diane Sanfilippo: Because it tastes really good.

Liz Wolfe: Most definitely.

Diane Sanfilippo: I have no commentary, because I don’t use natural anything on my hair.

Liz Wolfe: {laughing}

Diane Sanfilippo: Everything that I do with my hair is completely disgusting, chemical whatever, and I can’t apologize for it at this stage because I finally figured out how to style my hair and make it look cute, how I want it to look, and so throwing that all away for natural hair care is just not going to happen.

Liz Wolfe: You are Miss Hawaiian Tropic. {laughs} Why do you want to throw that all away?

Diane Sanfilippo: {laughs} I’m living on the edge. No, but I did try no-poo unsuccessfully for, not that long. I just basically try and mitigate some of it by only washing my hair maybe twice a week, and just using it less.

Liz Wolfe: Yeah.

Diane Sanfilippo: I haven’t used deodorant in a long time. {laughs} Anybody who’s been near me will know that.

Liz Wolfe: Can I get an Amen!

Diane Sanfilippo: Yeah, it’s pretty rough. But, yeah I kind of go with the whole, if it’s staying on your skin, it’s definitely a bigger deal than if you’re applying it and rinsing it off. I could be just making that up to justify my habits.

Liz Wolfe: Look. We can’t all do it all. It’s ok. And I just like all that hippie stuff. I really had a great time in the shower when I was no-pooing.

Diane Sanfilippo: {laughs} In the shower?

Liz Wolfe: Oh yeah.

Diane Sanfilippo: I was no-pooing in the shower.

Liz Wolfe: {laughs}

Diane Sanfilippo: Yeah, I think that’s awesome. I have a great time waking up at 8:00 o'clock, and washing dishes, and then chopping vegetables, and making things and cooking things, and that’s totally fun for me. And trying to figure out skin care and hair care is just not fun for me at all.

Liz Wolfe: {laughs}

Diane Sanfilippo: It’s not. But that’s why I have friends like you and Hayley.

Liz Wolfe: That’s why I’m here.

Diane Sanfilippo: I know. That’s why I now wash my face with only water. I don’t even oil cleanse. I just wipe all the makeup off with water.

Liz Wolfe: Yeah.

Diane Sanfilippo: If there’s makeup on, and then I put whatever on before I go to sleep. My, whatever that stuff is. Fish butt cream, as we call it {laughs}

Liz Wolfe: Your fish butt cream. Unless you have extremely large pores that get blackheads, that are very prone to blackheads, or your skin is really, really easily irritated by junk or dirt or whatever you might put on your face, like if you use standard drug store makeup and whatnot, I really think less is more. I think just wiping your face off at night can often be better than… You know, because a lot of people, they go from using 50,000 products on their face and really abusing their skin, trying to make it better, to really kind of over enthusiastically scrubbing and rubbing and spraying and using all of the natural products. It’s kind of like bringing those same old behaviors to a new routine. And sometimes, it’s the manner in which we’re using things that actually is what’s irritating our skin. So the less you can do, I think, working down to that point where you don’t have to do a whole lot, I think the better.

Diane Sanfilippo: It’s crazy.

Liz Wolfe: yeah.

Diane Sanfilippo: Yeah, but good stuff. Ok.

Liz Wolfe: Cool.

Diane Sanfilippo: Ok.

4. How to maintain a social life while making the paleo switch [22:26]

Liz Wolfe: Ok. Going paleo and losing friend. Shaun says, “hey ladies. I’m hoping you have some insight surrounding living the paleo lifestyle and having a social life. I’ve been paleo for almost a year now, and have been able to get off medications and put my ulcerative colitis in remission by eating real food. What a life changing experience. I couldn’t be happier. However, in doing so, I’ve had to abandon much of my social life. Everything my friends do involves eating and drinking. At first, I would still go out with them, and even occasionally indulge in a drink and some non-paleo snacks. But being that I’m still newly healed, my UC symptoms would return after my nights out. I’m now in the midst of the autoimmune protocol to further heal and to find out my triggers with more certainty. But in this process, I’ve also stopped spending time with my friends, and staying home to cook my own delicious AIP meals. I’d like to say that I have enough willpower so it’s not a problem, seeing people eat pizza, drink beer, and indulge in brownie sundaes, but I just don’t. So it’s been easier mentally to stay away. I love the way I feel and I’m so happy to have found this lifestyle, but I feel like I’m losing friends in the process. Do either of you have any advice on how to handle non-paleo social outings. What about friends that don’t get what you’re doing, and why? Thank you so much for this podcast. I never expected to love learning about food so much. The knowledge you ladies have and share with the world is so incredibly helpful.”

Diane Sanfilippo: Aww.

Liz Wolfe: Yeah, I think that’s enough. I won’t read the rest.

Diane Sanfilippo: That’s fine.

Liz Wolfe: What do you think?

Diane Sanfilippo: So we’ve talked about this topic a few times, so I will recommend that Shaun, I don’t know if this is a guy or a girl? Shaun. I feel like the name could go either way, maybe?

Liz Wolfe: I don’t know.

Diane Sanfilippo: I would recommend that Shaun listen back to at least one or two other times we’ve probably tackled this one just to see if we had different insights, because I know I’ve probably said this before that, you know, people have asked about our friends or what people say to us, and I think you and I have been teaching this stuff, and have written books about it long enough that it’s not new to them that this how we are and how we live, and people already know and expect it, you know what I mean? So we don’t really get the same reaction as somebody who may be new to paleo, if that kind of makes sense. So that being said, I think that the majority of what’s going on here outside of your, perhaps issues, with the willpower that you may have is really more about your friends having some insecurities around their own choices that are being reflected upon you if it turns out that they’re ridiculing you at all or just want to talk about it and be dismissive of it, like that’s ridiculous, or that’s crazy, or why not just have a piece of pizza, etc, etc. Perhaps, if there’s one friend who might get it a little bit more than the others, try and form somewhat of an alliance there. I know that in some of my circles, some of my older friends, they don’t all eat this way. But I do have one friend who is part of that circle who, for whatever reason, is maybe less threatening. I don’t really know what the deal is. But my friends, a lot of them don’t talk to me about what they eat, but maybe they’ll talk to her a little bit more. She pretty much eats gluten free, and pretty paleo, and is very selective and has always had a lot of issues around what foods she can tolerate or not, and I think that having her as part of my group of friends always helps when we go to parties, and I’m like, ok what are you bringing, let’s both bring something that we’re both going to eat, for example. Even if everyone else isn’t going to account for us. So how to handle the outings, honestly, eat before you go. Try not to talk about food and nutrition. Just divert the conversation if people want to ask about it, just change the subject. Have some stuff that you’re ready to talk about that’s just not about food. Try and hang out with your friends in settings that don’t focus on food. So even if food ends up in the picture, so maybe if you’re going to go bowling or play pool or go to a movie, there’s food everywhere. But maybe not just going out to dinner with people, because obviously that’s setting you up for failure, in a sense. But doing things that are different; sometimes I’ll just go hang out with friends, and we’ll just sit on the couch and watch a movie. I’ll bring my own food, or we’ll order food together, and I order what I want, they order what they want. No big deal. So, how to actually handle it and move through it is one thing; handling your friends mindset around what you’re doing, and just getting them to just drop it, and not talk about it if they’re not going to be chill, or just curious if they’re being argumentative or if they’re ridiculing you at all, it’s just super immature and just not necessary. And you know, if you really want to get gnarly with it, explain what happens to you the next day, and see if they ever bring it up again. {laughs} So, your UC symptoms are flaring up, that’s pretty gnarly, and painful, and not a cute situation. So, tell them what happens. And be like, this is what happens to me tomorrow if I eat this today, so do you want to talk more about that?

Liz Wolfe: {laughs} Do you want to talk more about my bloody stool? {laughs}

Diane Sanfilippo: Seriously! Be like, do you want to come over and help me, buy some fluids for me because now I’m dehydrated? Just level with them. I mean, maybe I’m just, you know, I’m always the really blunt, direct person, but I’m like, you know, I’ll be running to the bathroom if I eat that. So did you want to hear about that? I didn’t think so. Let’s move on. So, just different ways to handle it. It kind of depends on your friends. I tend to, if we’re going to go out and it’s friends that don’t eat paleo, no big deal. I have plenty of friends who don’t. I’ll just look at the menu ahead of time, or make sure there’s something I know I can order, or if they’re going somewhere that I can’t eat, I might just not go. It’s not that big of a deal. I do think autoimmune is way harder to dine out on autoimmune, so I think the advice to kind of focus on things that you can do where food isn’t the central thing, you know, going to a movie or whatever it may be, and just have your own food ready and eat before you go, etc. I don’t know. Further thoughts there? You don’t socialize with anyone, right? You just stay on the farm.

Liz Wolfe: No, no. Why do you think I moved out here?

Diane Sanfilippo: {laughs}

Liz Wolfe: I had actually kind of a similar situation when I was, there was a period that I just changed my life. I started pulling away from old behaviors, and friends, and kind of reevaluating what I actually wanted from my life. I think the difference is, it’s how you feel about the choices you’re making. It’s not so much the choices you’re making, it’s how you feel about them. So, for a long time, if I would have chosen to stay home, I would have felt really wrong about it, and it wouldn’t have been a good feeling. But then at one point, when I was pulling away from all these old messes that I was in, I just totally embraced that, like, I guess a nesting period, or whatever when I was just staying home, cooking my own food, going to bed early. Really taking care of myself. And I was staying home, but I felt good about it. I let myself feel good about not going out, and beer, and pizza, and late nights, and bad decisions all the time. Not saying Shaun’s making bad decisions all the time, but you know what I mean. It was just how I felt about it. Because all of a sudden, I was like, whoa, this rocks! I just made a great meal, I’m enjoying some quiet time, I’m going to sit on the porch, I’m going to go to bed at 8:30, read a book, and it felt great. So that’s one thing. And honestly, the friends that I was hanging out with all the time at that point in my life, and this was 7-8 years ago, honestly, those were the friends that were right there with me in pursuing some really naughty behaviors that included lots of late night drinking, smoking, a lot of cigarettes dot, dot, dot… Those friends faded away, and I realized that I didn’t miss them as much as I thought I would. And I thought my life would be just over if I didn’t participate. Really, at that point, the friends who were truly true friends became more prominent in my life, and they are the ones that are still my besties to this day. And I was blown away when I realized that I actually had friends that would want to go on a walk with me in the evenings, or go to spin class and make dinner together afterwards, and it turns out that those were the best friends all along. And that was kind of a process of separating, {laughs} the wheat from the chaff, bad gluten free metaphor, but whatever.

Diane Sanfilippo: {laughs}

Liz Wolfe: And I’m in a completely different place now than I believe I would have been, had I not embraced what was actually making me feel happy and healthy at that point in my life. And I just don’t think that you’ll lose the people that matter if you’re not around when they’re eating beer and pizza.

Diane Sanfilippo: Yeah, and I think that really points to, you know, why are you friends in the first place? Are you friends by default? There are definitely a lot of my old friends who, we probably would both admit, on either side, we’re friends by default. We grew up together, we went to school together. It wasn’t a choice that we consciously made to be friends, outside of, we played soccer. And sure, I wasn’t friends with everyone on the soccer team, but there were certain people I was friends with, and certain I wasn’t friends with. And so, usually your friends from growing up, or just location specific, a lot of them can be friends by default. And then think about who you may have become friends with as you’ve gotten older, and those friends are friends of yours because you have a lot in common, or something very important to you in common, and I think you’ll find, and Liz you’ve probably seen this with those friends you’re kind of talking about, is that you had something in common with them, and probably if you can go to a spin class and cook dinner or go for a walk, you have something really important in common. It’s that you care about your health.

Liz Wolfe: Mm-hmm.

Diane Sanfilippo: Even if your friend who cares about their health happens to eat differently than you do, just caring about is that thing that kind of keeps things going. And the friend that I was kind of mentioning who also eats the same way I do, but is in sort of my older group of friends, she’s that way too. She and I have always cooked together since we were little kids. She’s actually now in the Bauman program, distance learning, learning all about nutrition from a different perspective, and she will be that person who would go for a walk with me any time. You know?

Liz Wolfe: Mm-hmm.

Diane Sanfilippo: And so, we’ve always been kind of in sync in that way, even if we both were eating pizza at one point in time, and all of that stuff, so yeah. I do think that’s a huge part of it, and I guess I was trying to give the practical, what should I do now, but that’s kind of the bigger picture for sure. Why are you friends with these people, and it doesn’t mean they’re not great people with well meaning intentions and hearts, but if you don’t have a lot in common, then the friendship will just really naturally start to fizzle.

Liz Wolfe: Mm-hmm.

Diane Sanfilippo: I mean, I know you and I both, we have a lot of new friends who are these, we’re all like paleo peeps, and we have that in common. It doesn’t mean we’re friends with everybody who’s paleo, but having that in common then makes a lot of other things easier because we eat so many times a day.

Liz Wolfe: {laughing}

Diane Sanfilippo: I mean I eat, like, 10 times a day. Just kidding.

Liz Wolfe: I heard this place has duck fat fries. Let’s go!

Diane Sanfilippo: Yeah. That’s our conversation, right? We’ll be on the road, and we’re like, oh this place has amazing farm to table food. And there’s three hours of our day. We just drove to the place, ate the food, and then left. So much of your time together. I think that’s a good one, a good point.

5. Stuck in the chicken, broccoli, and coconut oil rut [34:03]

Liz Wolfe: Yeah. Ok.

Diane Sanfilippo: Helps!

Liz Wolfe: Help! I’m in the chicken, broccoli, coconut oil rut, and I can’t get out! {laughs} Sarah says, “Hi Liz and Diane, I love your podcast, and think you have really great information to share. Keep up the good work. My question is, I’ve been eating paleo for about a year and a half now, and I’m feeling better than ever. No more belly bloat, chronic sinus infections, joint pain, low energy, etc. My problem is, I’m stuck in the chicken, broccoli, coconut oil rut.” {gasp} Dun-dun-dunnnn! “About 10 years ago, I gave up red meat and pork for health reasons, go figure, and over the last year I’ve tried to add them back into my diet, but my body is really not happy with this decision. I won’t go into detail about the consequences I endure, but it ain’t pretty. I feel like my body is no longer able to process any meats other than poultry and fish. I eat fish on occasion, but my husband isn’t a fan of fish, especially the smell, so the majority of my protein comes from eggs and chicken. Boring! Do you have any suggestions on how I can retrain my body not to be such a hater! Enzymes perhaps? Thanks so much for your help.” So, she’s eating stuff like one to two eggs, and veggies, and extra fat for breakfast, and a piece of fruit. Kale salad, mushrooms, tomatoes, cucumbers, peppers, chicken, avocado, and olive oil, and a cup of extra veggies for lunch. Sweet potato, dinner grilled chicken and veggies. Snacks nuts, Larabar, fruit, dark chocolate. Yeah. So, chicken, broccoli, coconut oil rut. Try a few new things. See how it goes. And, this whole thing with meat, for some people that is more of a psychological issue that manifests physically. When you try a few bites of, say, beef or red meat, or whatever and you just can’t tolerate it, it very well can be mental manifesting physically. So it may not be that you’re intolerant to it, especially if you were eating other meats before that. So, it’s possible that some digestive support, like some enzymes, or some stomach acid support would be a good idea. And I think, Diane don’t you have a post of, you want more stomach acid, does that give recommendations for an HCl protocol? I know I have one in the Skintervention Guide.

Diane Sanfilippo: I’m not sure. I can’t remember what the recommendations I put in there, but yeah, I do have definitely tips on how to improve that.

Liz Wolfe: Ok. How to improve stomach acid. So that could definitely be helpful, and maybe you just need kind of that one extra things, like taking some enzymes or whatever to make your brain release that aversion to red meat and pork. And I wouldn’t say you need to eat pork, by any means, but I do think that bison and grass fed beef has some really nice health properties that are probably worth trying to add them back, if you can. And also, cook them really well. It will make them a little bit more easily digested, and especially if you’re doing soups and stews where you’re using bone broth. Because bone broth does have some constituents that help us utilize the nutrition from the meat itself. So, that’s something to think about. But also, you don’t have to start with the obvious. You don’t have to start with red meat. You can kind of expand your repertoire in different ways. Like, trying a different way of preparing something, or trying foods, or fruits, or vegetables or whatever that you’ve never eaten before. And just, slowly expanding your circle so you feel a little bit more adventurous and a little bit more excited about these things. I never thought in my life I would be excited about eating bone marrow. Like, are you kidding me, that’s ridiculous. But you know, you start adding little things here and there. I remember having star fruit for the first time, I remember having kale for the first time, and kohlrabi, and jicama, and all of these things that I wasn’t used to and making different things out of them, and I started to get more excited about trying new things. And then all of a sudden, I’m eating pork liver mousse, and head cheese. {laughs} So you just never know where this road is going to take you. So, don’t get too focused on adding one thing back right away. You can kind of play with other things first, and see if you can circle back to red meat. Diane, do you have any thoughts on this?

Diane Sanfilippo: Nope, I don’t. Nothing additional.

Liz Wolfe: I just nailed it?

Diane Sanfilippo: Yeah. I mean, you touched on everything I was thinking.

Liz Wolfe: Nailed it!

Diane Sanfilippo: Yeah. Well, and kind of how to add certain things back, also, not just all the stuff you talked about. But with all the new cookbooks coming out, it’s like, find something that looks appealing and pick one recipe.

Liz Wolfe: Mm-hmm.

Diane Sanfilippo: You know, it’s not like this week you’re eating mostly what you’re normally eating, and then next week you should eat 10 different kinds of meat. You know? Pick one thing. Get really good at making it. Move on. And just kind of let that accumulate. I just wouldn’t overwhelm yourself with trying to change it all up at once, you know what I mean?

Liz Wolfe: Mm-hmm.

Diane Sanfilippo: That would make it, I think, a lot easier.

Liz Wolfe: That’s why I’m so excited about the Mediterranean Paleo Cooking, because I love Mediterranean food, paleo or not.

Diane Sanfilippo: So good!

Liz Wolfe: I’m going to go through every dang page of that book. I’m going to make everything! And I’m excited about that! And there’s probably stuff in there that I haven’t tried before, or haven’t tried very many times, and I’m going to be excited to do it. So maybe it’s just, you need to get it in that right context.

Diane Sanfilippo: Totally.

6. Shortcuts and tips for cooking paleo when short on time [39:24]

Liz Wolfe: Totes. Alright. How do I transition from the 21DSD to everyday life? Laura says, “Now I’m working through what life looks like post detox. My goal is to go strict paleo, but I’m a working mom, and find trouble finding time to cook all our meals, while still keeping a semi clean house and working out 4-5 days a week. While my body is feeling better, I’m getting depressed because I haven’t been working out, and my house is a complete mess. Can you ladies make some recommendations on food shortcuts? I love your recipes, and have been making double batches for freezing, but I’m still spending more time than I realistically have in the kitchen. Any other tips? Do you have any suggestion for quick and easy meals, or some kitchen tools that would save time? This is my biggest hurdle for healthy eating, and frankly I’m pretty new to cooking, so I’ve yet to reach that level of creating my own dishes. I get home at 6 p.m., and it takes me at least an hour to get dinner on the table, which is exhausting for both my husband and my kids. This can make dinner time stressful, when it really should be about sharing a meal and enjoying each other’s company. Additional info, a typical workday breakfast would be the 21DSD vanilla bean banana oatmeal”, or I’m guessing it’s not actually oatmeal.

Diane Sanfilippo: N’oatmeal.

Liz Wolfe: N’oatmeal, or a hardboiled egg and a piece of fruit. Lunch is usually leftovers from the night before if available, or prosciutto, guacamole, cucumber slices, and carrots. My quick and easy on the run lunch. For dinner, I’ve been rotating 21DSD recipes and some other paleo recipes from the web or my recent purchase of Against All Grain, love the Mexican soup in that one. I take fermented cod liver oil about every other day. I’m a runner, but because of the winter weather, I’ve been doing some dance aerobics and calisthenics.

Diane Sanfilippo: {laughs} Oops.

Liz Wolfe: What?

Diane Sanfilippo: Guess this one’s been in the bank a long time.

Liz Wolfe: Well, we don’t know, she might be in North Dakota.

Diane Sanfilippo: Winter weather? Ohh.

Liz Wolfe: She might be in Canada.

Diane Sanfilippo: It’s June. Ok.

Liz Wolfe: I know.

Diane Sanfilippo: She could be in San Francisco.

Liz Wolfe: {laughs} Yeah. She could be, isn’t the weather the opposite in Australia.

Diane Sanfilippo: Yeah, she could be there.

Liz Wolfe: Oh, wait. Is that just the water circles around the toilet, in the opposite way?

Diane Sanfilippo: The seasons are too, I think.

Liz Wolfe: Ok. I take… wait, wait, wait. I’ve been doing dance aerobics and calisthenics at home. I usually work out at least 4 days a week for about an hour, but now it’s down to only 2 days a week for an hour at a time. I still have a couple of glasses of red wine in the evening. I’m trying to kick this habit.

Diane Sanfilippo: So, the question seemed to be about transitioning from the 21DSD but it really sounds more like, making cooking quick and easy meals easier. My biggest advice on this whole thing, first of all, what I’m cooking at home most of the time it’s not anything from a recipe. And I know she’s saying she’s not really at that stage of her cooking skills to kind of just throw something together, but I think people have weird expectations or high expectations of themselves of what they should be putting together every day. And I’m pretty sure my mom cooked maybe about 10 different things that she was good at my entire life. And if I look at what I’m making pretty much every day, it’s kind of the same thing. It’s a big salad for lunch, and the biggest quick and easy tip on that is just having lots of different vegetables available that are already cooked or in their raw form that are easy to eat, like carrots or cucumbers, and I have been buying love beets, which are organic precooked beets. Which I know, they’re not that hard to cook, but I just never seem to do it. So, buying these, I’m eating lots of beets, which I think are great for you. So that’s kind of one tip, just to have stuff that’s already ready and to do your cooking in batches, as she’s mentioning, but even a step beyond that. If you’re baking anything, buys some extra chicken or buy some extra chops, or whatever it is that you’re using, and literally throw a pan of chicken thighs or something in the oven while you’re cooking tonight’s dinner; maybe that’s tomorrow dinner that you’re cooking tonight. All you have to do is take one minute to sprinkle some seasoning on it, salt pepper, one of my spice blends, and just bake that, and then it’s done. I just think over thinking or worrying about “making a recipe”, quote unquote, really complicates things, and most nights of the week, we’re making burgers, or it’s ground meat that’s just cooked into taco meat or something like that. Really quick and easy stuff. I mean, if you ask me to tell you what I had for dinner the last 5 nights, I don’t even know if I could remember.

Liz Wolfe: Mm-hmm.

Diane Sanfilippo: Because it’s nothing earth shattering or memorable. I mean, I’d have to look at Instagram and see if I took a picture of it, because I don’t even know what I’ve eaten. But I do know that part of it, as she’s saying, I’m spending more time than I have; how is that even possible? {laughs} You’re spending time that you have, so it seems like there are other things in your life that maybe are taking up more time than they should. So this is where I’m going to get into the, reprioritizing your time thing. So, I don’t know how much time she’s spending, and if it’s more time than you have, it’s not possible that you’ve just spent it. So, somehow you had that time. So what else in your life is taking up a lot of time? I know tons of parents will ask me, they’re driving their kids to 4 different practices in a night, and I’m like, ok, well can there be something that is simplified there? And that’s a hard question to answer, right, because you’re like, well I don’t want to take this away from my kid, but if you’re overcomplicating everything about your life, and a lot of time is being sucked into other things. I mean, I can easily let the internet and just answering people’s questions on Twitter and Instagram, I can let that be a time suck or I can just ignore for half an hour or an hour, and go cook something. And it happens to all of us. But I think there’s also room for just reprioritizing your time in that way, and I don’t spend an hour in the evening cooking dinner. I get home from the gym, and I’m thinking about what I’m going to cook in the car on the way home, and it’s usually something that’s been defrosted and it takes me under 20 minutes to cook dinner. And I think part of that process is, as I’ve said in this whole response, doing things that you know how to do, not trying to overcomplicate it, and getting your family used to the fact that it’s not going to be some gourmet meal every single night. It’s going to be the things that everybody loves. Maybe you just try one new spice. Maybe you add one new vegetable into the mix here or there. We were mentioning with the proteins for the previous question, don’t overcomplicate it by feeling like there’s some expectation of how you should be eating. I’m just going to say it right now; all of us who write any sort of book or cookbook, we don’t eat that way most of the time. We eat that way when we’re writing a book and we’re trying to be creative and give you guys lots of ideas, and we eat that food. But, most nights of the week it’s like ground meat and a lettuce boat. It’s just not; I mean, I don’t know what you eat every night, but I’m pretty sure it’s not that complicated, right? I mean, Good Food for Bad Cooks.

Liz Wolfe: Beef and tomato sauce.

Diane Sanfilippo: {laughs} Yeah, it’s like…

Liz Wolfe: Done.

Diane Sanfilippo: Nothing super complicated. I know it’s different, too. We don’t have families where it’s a lot of people trying to agree on something, but with Scott, I’ll maybe ask him one thing, like this or that, and then I just cook it. Whatever it is, there are certain vegetables that I cook that he doesn’t love, and I’m like, I don’t really care. You’re going to eat this.

Liz Wolfe: {laughing}

Diane Sanfilippo: I can’t be managing every flavor or texture that we both love or don’t love. It’s just, this is what I’m cooking, take it or leave it. If you want something else, you can cook it. She’s asking for some other really practical tips. I mean, I have a food processor, I have really good knives, I have more than one cutting board. I think that all really helps make things faster, but I don’t think any of those are the magic.

Liz Wolfe: What’s it called, a mise en place, what is that? Do you just kind of figure out exactly where your spots are in the kitchen?

Diane Sanfilippo: No. Well, mise en place is generally, it’s such a chef kitchen thing. It kind of make me laugh, too, like trying to give the home cook tips on that, because home cooks are not generally preparing diced onions and peppers tonight for like tomorrow and the next days’ meals, because we don’t need perfectly diced things to eat, and we don’t need X amount of it.

Liz Wolfe: Oh, ok.

Diane Sanfilippo: But it generally means, everything is in its place and it’s prepared and ready. So, I think there’s validity to having, if you feel like every night of the week you’re just chopping vegetables and it takes you forever, which, my kitchen tip previously on how to hold a knife should help with that. But if that’s a huge hurdle for you, then figure out a way to make that all done at once and batch that task. Get it all done at once. I don’t like to cut a lot of my vegetables ahead of time because vitamin C will be lost. It’s not about perfectionism, but I am home so I can chop the vegetables. I chop things quickly, so I’m not going to take that shortcut. I’ll take other shortcuts, but that’s not one of them. I don’t wash most of my produce. I consider that to be a shortcut. {laughs}

Liz Wolfe: {laughs}

Diane Sanfilippo: I just don’t think it’s that necessary. Baking extra chicken thighs, or something like that, that’s kind of a good shortcut.

Liz Wolfe: Yes. Bulk cooking, and eating leftovers, leftovers, leftovers. And this is also, you know she’s transitioning from the 21DSD, and it’s like, you’re still learning to rearrange things. I get that. And it can be a little bit intimidating because you’ve been doing one thing for a long time, and then you sign up for this challenge where you’re ready for the changes, and you kind of are ready to invest for the short term, right? And so that feels a little bit more like, I can do this for 21 days.

Diane Sanfilippo: Right.

Liz Wolfe: But then after that, you want to keep going, and it’s like, ok, I really do have to live, you know, live a normal life. I understand how emotionally that can be a little bit taxing. But here’s another thing; practice makes perfect. You have 21 days on the detox to learn some amazing behaviors and reset your metabolism, and do some really good things for yourself. But then, hat’s off to her for asking this question, because she does want to continue these behaviors. You have to realize, you’ve learned the behaviors and now you have to practice them. And they’ll get faster, and they’ll get easier, and you’ll find the shortcuts that work for you. I love the leftovers thing, I love the cooking in bulk thing. I love the pressure cooker, because I would always forget to put stuff in the slow cooker in the morning for the evening, and a pressure cooker can make something pretty decent in about an hour, hour and a half. So that’s, I think, a good little shortcut. But also, I understand the dirty house thing. I don’t even have kids, and I’m hard pressed to have a single room in my house clean at any given time. So I’m like, if I had kids, I don’t know how this would work. It probably wouldn’t work. But then you kind of have to ask yourself; I don’t think she’s saying she has festering trash in the house.

Diane Sanfilippo: {laughs}

Liz Wolfe: And child protective services is going to come. It’s probably like, there are toys on the floor, there’s unfolded laundry, stuff like that. And let’s just kind of birds eye view this thing, the way we think about what’s important is a clean house or is clean eating more important? Bird’s eye view, I think nourishing your family as best you can is a lot more important than having all the toys put away. And I don’t know if maybe that’s a behavior you don’t want to foster or something, I don’t know, but I still think if you’re choosing between behaviors that you want to foster in your family, I think healthy eating and prioritizing, making food at home is a really, really good behavior to try and foster. So hopefully, that makes her feel a little bit better about that. It might not be easier, but it is more important. And maybe while she’s cooking, the family is cleaning. I don’t know. {laughs} Figure that out.

Diane Sanfilippo: Yeah.

Liz Wolfe: Division of tasks. I’m making you food to eat, you’re going to clean while I do it.

Diane Sanfilippo: Yeah. Or clean up after. You know?

Liz Wolfe: Yup.

Diane Sanfilippo: And someone else is doing that. I mean, I don’t know. I feel like {laughs} when I read over the question again, again it was like, totally asking for practical shortcut tips, and we just made it this whole philosophical debate, which is pretty standard.

Liz Wolfe: Yup. Pretty normal.

Diane Sanfilippo: Yeah, but I mean. Yeah.

Liz Wolfe: Scrambled eggs, ground beef and clean premade tomato sauce over zucchini noodles or spaghetti squash, and red wine. Done.

Diane Sanfilippo: hashtag – this is how I really eat.

Liz Wolfe: This is how I really eat. I think that would be a good hashtag.

Diane Sanfilippo: I know. This is the joke that I used to make with Bill and Hayley when we were working on, maybe it was Practical Paleo, or I was over at their house when they were working on Gather, and it was like, you were cooking something really interesting for a book, and then you’re eating chicken thighs and salad.

Liz Wolfe: Yeah.

Diane Sanfilippo: I mean, we eat the same kinds of things all the time. So, I don’t know.

Liz Wolfe: It will get easier. It really will. With practice.

Diane Sanfilippo: I just think there’s some kind of expectation going on there that’s like, nobody needs to expect a gourmet meal every night.

Liz Wolfe: Or a clean house every night.

Diane Sanfilippo: I mean, my house is. Nope. It’s not that clean. Nope.

Liz Wolfe: No.

Diane Sanfilippo: I’ve got other things to do.

Liz Wolfe: True that. Alright.

Diane Sanfilippo: Ok.

Liz Wolfe: So I think we’re good for the day. 52 minutes?

Diane Sanfilippo: Yeah, I think we should probably wrap it up. I’ve got to go…

Liz Wolfe: Lift all the things?

Diane Sanfilippo: Lift some heavy things, and put them back down.

Liz Wolfe: Let me go make sure there’s not a snake in the chicken coop.

Diane Sanfilippo: Alright.

Liz Wolfe: We might be having snake for dinner.

Diane Sanfilippo: Oh, I need to give you guys a kitchen tip.

Liz Wolfe: Yup.

7. Diane’s kitchen tip [53:16]

Diane Sanfilippo: Alright. Even though we were basically doing kitchen tips that whole time. My kitchen tip for this week is a way to make broth that’s not based on just buying a pack of bones and kind of going for it. You can save up bones to make broth, and I definitely recommend doing this if you have pastured meats or anything that you’re buying that’s super high quality and you just don’t want to throw those bones away. Like pastured chicken, for example. I recommend freezing the bones; you can do it in one of those big gallon sized zip-top bags or whatever type of container works best for you, and you can freeze them. I recommend freezing the bones by type, so I wouldn’t just throw all of the bones, like beef and chicken and pork and lamb, all together, just because the flavors are going to get really mixed, but if you don’t care and you like the flavors mixed, then go for it. But you can eat your food, and then go ahead and keep those bones, put them in a bag in the freezer, and when you have a full bags worth of bones, you can go ahead and make broth from that. So there you go. Are you muted? And you’ve disappeared into being muted?

Liz Wolfe: Oh. Am I back?

Diane Sanfilippo: {laughs} Now you’re back.

Liz Wolfe: I was talking. Alright, so that’s it. We’ll be back next week with more questions. If you’ve been enjoying the podcast, please remember to subscribe in iTunes and help us spread the word by leaving a review. As always, you can find Diane at DianeSanfilippo.com, one L, two P’s, and you can find me at RealFoodLiz.com. Be sure to join our email lists, where we provide exclusive content to our subscribers that we don’t put anywhere else. Thanks for listening.

Cheers! Diane & Liz