Balanced Bites Podcast: Episode #2: Celiac Disease, Fertility & Paleo, Weight Gain, Vitamin D, PMS, Raw Food

LIZ WOLFE: Hey, everyone, I'm Liz Wolfe, sidekick to Diane Sanfilippo of Balanced Bites;welcome back to the Balanced Bites podcast, round 2. We're still on the air; we haven't been kicked off, so that's awesome. Hey, Diane, what's going on?

DIANE SANFILIPPO: Hey, not too much, just got back from the farmer's market this morning. Just kind of like trolling around down there, the sun was shining down there even though it's kind of cloudy in my neighborhood, which is pretty typical for San Francisco, the little microclimates that we have here, and just kind of poked around and checked out some seasonal produce. Got some figs, and I wasn't planning on buying any more meat because last weekend I was up at a different market and probably hauled home about 20 pounds of pastured, grass-fed meat and chicken wings at the [xxx 0:50] farm's tent, and I just couldn't resist. So anyway, that's pretty much it, that's this morning. Just hanging out, just sitting here chatting with you. What have you been up to today?

LIZ WOLFE: I went to a farmer's market as well. Just picked up a bunch of good stuff. Let's see. Yeah, we're boring. Don't have a lot going on, we've just been sitting outside and enjoying it, hanging out. Nothing, nothing clever.

DIANE SANFILIPPO: Yeah. Is it pretty hot on the East Coast? How's it been?

LIZ WOLFE: I don't even know. This like trips me out. We've got earthquakes, hurricanes, what else did we just have? I don't know. There's something else crazy. We bought a little mini yard wad before the hurricane.

DIANE SANFILIPPO: Oh nice.

LIZ WOLFE: And bought about 50 sandbags and just moved them from Home Depot to the yard, trying to keep our basement from flooding, which is always awesome. You know?

DIANE SANFILIPPO: Yeah. Nice.

LIZ WOLFE: So yeah, at this point, I think it'll be all right, so we'll see.

DIANE SANFILIPPO: A lot of functional movement.

LIZ WOLFE: Definitely.

DIANE SANFILIPPO: It seems like most of my friends back east stay pretty dry. I saw one of my friends posted a video. Her backyard was kind of flooded, and her dogs were really enjoying it, but I haven't heard anything too epic from anyone, so that's kind of a no news is good news for me, at least for my friends and family, and I'll be back there again next week; so actually by the time this goes live, I'll probably be flying East that day. So yeah, I'll be-I think we'll probably be recording the next one from the East Coast, so we'll be in the same time zone, so that will be pretty fun, so for once.

LIZ WOLFE: That will be awesome. We can fight it out over one mike and see what happens. It'll be awesome.

DIANE SANFILIPPO: Yeah, that will be fun. Cool. So I just have a couple of quick announcements and one of them pertains to a question that we got just through-I don't remember if it was from a reply to blog post or someone submitted the question asking about events in the Chicago area, which currently I don't have anything planned for Practical Paleo seminars in the Chicago area at this point. I'm thinking possibly next year maybe in the Spring. I will probably not want to travel to Chicago in the winter. But probably in the Spring. And just to give people a head's up, September 17th, I'll be in Philadelphia at Crossfit Center City; it's Saturday all day. All these seminars that are Saturday all day seminars, and so Philadelphia Crossfit Center City, September 17th, and then back here in the Bay area at Crossfit Excel in Manteca on October 1st, and then back to the East Coast again, November 12th at Crossfit ECT, which is in Saddlebrook in New Jersey. And all these events are open to anyone. You don't have to be a member of that gym. You don't even have to be a Crossfitter. Really anyone can come. You can check out all of the events, dates, etc., through BalancedBites.com. So you can check out all the information there. So that's that.

LIZ WOLFE: Very cool.

DIANE SANFILIPPO: Yeah. So do you want to get into some questions?

LIZ WOLFE: Yeah, let's jump right in here. All right, the first one is from Hannah. What's the name for-what's it called when something's the same back and forth? Is that a palindrome? What is that?

DIANE SANFILIPPO: God. I think so. Or an anagram?

LIZ WOLFE: Hannah..

DIANE SANFILIPPO: Anagram? Palindrome?

LIZ WOLFE: I'm going to make myself look really stupid.

DIANE SANFILIPPO: Aren't you the English major?

LIZ WOLFE: Oh, goodness. All right, Celiac disease, meal plan, and supplementation. Hannah asks, What type of meal plan would you recommend for someone who has Celiac Disease? I am starting my Paleo lifestyle on the 24th but would love to know about supplementation. And we may be a little late ,unless she's talking about September 24th, in which case, start today.

DIANE SANFILIPPO: Yeah, I don't know when that question came in, but we're trying to wrangle them up so they're at least pretty current, but we did have a little bit of a backlog. Anyway, so what type of meal plan first and then she's talking about supplementation. The number one, which I'm pretty sure she's heard this before, but to be 100% gluten free is really a must. It's an always, no exceptions, kind of thing, and this doesn't just mean gluten in the forms that are easy to find. Like wheat, barley, rye, you know, the actual grains. This means even so far as vinegars, that could be a malt vinegar, soy sauce has been fermented with wheat, anything that's had any sort of wheat involved in the processing of it. And the list is pretty extensive. I have a handout, it's a pdf guide for becoming a gluten detective, is what I call it. And the first page is really common ingredients and foods to avoid, and which ones should be gluten free and safe. And then the other side is an extensive list of ingredients that can contain gluten or can cause reactivity. So I definitely recommend that she downloads that. We'll link to it from the post on BalancedBites.com about this podcast, but definitely check that out. And there's also a restaurant card on that handout, so I recommend printing it, cutting it out, keeping it in your wallet. You can also go to CeliacTravel.com. They have it in all different languages, and that's where I kind of adapted that restaurant card from. All different languages for that card, so anywhere you travel, just give it to a waiter or waitress. So I definitely recommend that, obviously. And also realistically, any processed foods can have a risk of contamination. Things can have a risk of cross-contamination just from processing, so keeping to a pretty clean Paleo diet that's grain free is usually your best bet. So in terms of meal plan, it really depends on how much healing you need to do. I don't know if you're dealing with nutrient mal-absorption. Celiac disease used to commonly be pretty visible in terms of like being underweight. People would lose weight pretty easily because they're mal-absorbing, but we do see a lot of gluten sensitivity and celiac now showing up in the opposite direction in terms of weight gain. So it kind of depends. Your meal plan will depend on that a little bit. Bottom line you need to do things that are-cook foods that are simple to digest , so things that are well-cooked. Stews, soups, things that you can make in a Crockpot. Broth is really helpful for that. There's-I have a broth recipe on the website. And just keeping things that are pretty simple. Simple or more broken down first. And then when you kind of move on, there's a diet that we hear a lot about called the GAPS diet. And that stands for Gut And Psychology Syndrome, so if you're curious what-why GAPS even means, that's really all it stands for. And it was developed by Natasha Campbell-McBride, and what it is is just getting foods in that are easy to digest or at least commonly easy to digest. We just want to give your digestive system a break, so that we're not worrying about it being more irritated by foods. So that's pretty much it. You know there's nothing too earth-shattering about what you should or shouldn't eat beyond the list of what I just explained, but keeping it more simple, and really eating at home as much as possible, will be your best bet. I mean, that's pretty common for anyone who's dealing with any sort of conditions that they're trying to bounce back from. In terms of supplementation, what I would recommend, and these are things I would for pretty much anyone who's dealing with a leaky gut situation or just digestive distress in general. Glutamine can be really helpful; it's an amino acid. It comes typically in a powder form. Around 2 grams per day in some water. I like it in lemon water. You can do that twice a day. It's usually pretty innocuous, like people usually really don't have too many side effects from it. If you happen to experience any constipation from that, then just back off with how much you're taking, but 2 grams, twice or so a day in water should be pretty mild, but pretty helpful in repairing. Glutamine's just generally helpful in repairing tissues so when we say, you know, to use it for stuff like gut repair, that's something that Donna Gates, who wrote The Body Ecology Diet; she recommends specifically for that. So I would give that a whirl. It also can be really helpful in curbing sugar cravings, so just kind of another benefit of glutamine. Omega-3s, I would make sure that you're taking a good amount of omega-3 fats for anti-inflammatory purposes: Wild caught fish, salmon, mackerel, those kinds of things. Walnuts. Or you can go with like a couple of grams of an omega -3 supplement. Fermented cod liver oil is a good way to get it. It's not too too high in the omega-3, but it will have a nice balance of vitamins A and D in there as well. Green Pastures is a good brand or Carlson's I think makes one, too. One that's fermented as well. I would recommend making sure you're getting enough zinc. In terms of food sources, you can get that from lamb, pumpkin seeds and things like that. If you're looking for a supplement, ZMA might be something good to get some zinc from; it's usually zinc, magnesium, and maybe some B-6 in the ZMA supplement. But really just trying to get it from foods in general. Also lamb is a really nice source of zinc. Great in a Crockpot. And then some quercetin, which again, you can get this from foods; it's an anti-inflammatory phyto-nutrient. You know, blueberries, other richly colored foods, vegetables and fruits, but if you're looking for something to add in, boost to you in healing, you know that can be something that you look for in a supplement form. But you can really get all of that from your diet. That's kind of what I would say, mostly for celiac disease or really any kind of severe food allergies, leaky gut, someone's who reacting to a lot of foods. That's going to be a pretty common approach for all of them. Liz, did you have anything else that you wanted to add to that?

LIZ WOLFE: Well, I was going to ask you what you think about-you know, a lot of these non-Paleo-type celiac intervention diets, like gluten free diet. Paleo pretty much lends itself to the [xxx 11:23]. People have gluten intolerance, which is a pretty perfect way to go, but I was thinking about how a lot of people still incorporate things like cheeses and heavy cream and stuff like that. I guess heavy cream would probably be fine, but as far as casein goes, is that something to think about as far as making sure you're keeping hard cheeses, and stuff like that out of the rotation based on cross-reactivity, I guess with gluten intolerance.

DIANE SANFILIPPO: Hmm. I definitely recommend that somebody do that for at least the first month or even two months, just because you don't know how much would be exacerbating some of the symptoms of the celiac disease because of that cross-reactivity. And when we say, cross-reactivity, it basically means you know, you may respond to gluten very poorly, but you may respond to gluten even worse if you're also eating diary that has high levels of casein in it. So usually people do tend to eat those things together and getting them all out is really just the best way to reset. So I would definitely recommend that somebody get rid of all of that at first, because later you can try adding them back. Things that you're not potentially 100% allergic to and see how you do, but yeah, I would say to just calm the system down and let that inflammation come down, it would definitely get that out as well.

LIZ WOLFE: So how do you feel about nightshades, like a Paleo style Celiac intervention as far as would you remove those for 30 days as well and reintroduce?

DIANE SANFILIPPO: Nightshades?

LIZ WOLFE: Or is it a little too much trouble?

DIANE SANFILIPPO: For nightshades, I wouldn't necessarily say that the person has to go as far as to remove nightshades for a Celiac intervention. If the person experiences joint pain, or those kinds of aches and pains in the joints, typically, that's something that I would say, okay, nightshades could be at the root of that. But otherwise, I wouldn't say that it's probably the biggest issue for them, and with as many changes as they're making, I probably wouldn't fuss too much over nightshades at that point.

LIZ WOLFE: Gotcha.

DIANE SANFILIPPO: It just-it really depends on the person because somebody can, you know, you could easily be experiencing symptoms with Celiac disease or even just a severe gluten intolerance, and you might be eating salsa every single day, which you know, tomatoes, potatoes, peppers, and eggplants are in the nightshade category. If you're eating that stuff every day, I mean it might just be nice to check out, okay, maybe I'll rotate it a little bit, or just what happens if I don't eat it for a few days if you experience that stuff, but otherwise I don't think that has a specific effect with Celiac.

LIZ WOLFE: Cool.

DIANE SANFILIPPO: Yeah.

LIZ WOLFE: All right, and just one other point I know, though I'm sure this doesn't apply to Hannah because she does say she's starting her Paleo lifestyle, but gluten free baked goods, gluten free processed foods are no bueno.

DIANE SANFILIPPO: Yeah. No.

LIZ WOLFE: They don't count.

DIANE SANFILIPPO: Yeah, I mean-the handout that I have on gluten. You know, it's really specifically, like I list things on there that are okay, and the only reason they're listed as okay is that technically they're gluten free, but really when you're dealing with this kind of intolerance, and like I said before, especially at first, getting all that stuff out. Because they have some similar amino acid structures or similar protein structures, that can all be possibly irritating. So yeah, and that stuff is all just refined, processed food anyway, which I mean, I'm rolling my eyes over here like c'mon, let's get that stuff out. Eventually later we can deal with figuring out which treats we can handle, but yeah, I'm with you on that. No-No gluten free treats.

LIZ WOLFE: All right. Okay, next question is from Jane. Fertility and Paleo. Jane asks, We are trying to get pregnant with number 2. How will Paleo affect our chances? And what should I be focusing on in my diet?

DIANE SANFILIPPO: Okay, so-and I don't know if you hear the same audio that I'm hearing as everyone else will hear, but that first part of the question is that they're trying to get pregnant with number two? Somehow you cut out on the trying to, so it sounded like they were already pregnant? But, so she says they're trying to get pregnant, and how it would affect our chances, and what should I be focusing. Well, so how it will affect chances, in terms of looking at whatever's happening in your body with your hormone levels or any inflammation or stress in your system, Paleo's really an ideal approach. You're getting rid of inflammatory foods, you're getting rid of food toxins. You may even find that just removing gluten and wheat increases fertility. I've seen this happen or I've heard of it from a few other practitioners who said you know, been dealing with someone who's had infertility, and they just removed gluten, and conceived.

LIZ WOLFE: Mm-hmm.

DIANE SANFILIPPO: A lot of time what's happening is that autoimmune response that we talk about a lot where the person's body, they're not digesting those proteins completely and attack them and also attack other cells in our body as a response. Those other cells can be any kind of cells, and it could even be hormones, so if you're not having-if you don't have a good hormone balance, then your chances of conceiving are usually hindered at that point. And stress is a huge factor, I know. I talk about this in my seminar in terms of when I talk about cholesterol, and hormones, and all that kind of balance. But stress can really derail your efforts in terms of getting pregnant because when you're experiencing stress response and this can be in-

LIZ WOLFE: Jim?

DIANE SANFILIPPO: Ooo! This can be with food; your body could be under stress because you're eating irritating foods or you could just be stressed out with your lifestyle. But when hormone production gets shifted more to the stress-stress hormones, so the whole chain of stress hormones, cortisol and other stress hormones, your sex hormones tend to suffer because it's a secondary function. Your body needs to survive, it doesn't need to reproduce. So just finding ways of reducing stress and again with diet and getting rid of food toxins and inflammation and response to food will definitely up your chances, so that's kind of on the plus side. Should you be focused on it? Well, I would definitely say focusing on keeping a very well balanced, sort of a mixed plate of fats, proteins, and carbohydrates, making sure you get a lot of different foods to just kind of build your nutrient stores. Lots of different colors. There's plenty of fats. Again I've got a resource for that on which fats to eat and which ones you want to get rid of. Wild-caught fish, high in omega-3s. You really want to get as much of that good omega-3s and DHA fat into your system, so that when your baby is developing, it has a great chance of getting a lot of fat, and you will become sort of nutrient-depleted when you're pregnant. You know, this baby is pulling a lot from you, so you really want to get really nutrient-dense foods into the system, so avoid the processed foods so you can kind of build up as much as possible. And a point about the omega-3s and the DHA, specifically, but it's common that some women will experience like post-partum depression or even just kind of that foggy headedness after giving birth, a lot of that is just a DHA deficiency or an omega-3 deficiency. So building up those stores ahead of time is a really good idea. I definitely recommend checking out Chris Kresser's Healthy Baby Code. I have a link to it and a whole interview with him on the blog that you can check out, finding out more about just nutrition and any possible supplementation with pregnancy. And one other thing in terms of what else you should focus on, and I've heard a lot of women who are trying to get pregnant and/or are pregnant, that they find increasing their carbs during that time is helpful, so that doesn't mean chowing down on four sweet potatoes a day, but if you've been avoiding things like starchy tubers, just kind of coming back around to it is a good idea, just keeping any sort of-any stress in your system at bay, and getting that nice balance can really be helpful. So, yeah, Liz, do you have some notes to add here on fertility and Paleo?

LIZ WOLFE: I do, but first I got to ask you. Did we just have a Saturday Night Live moment? I thought I put my mike on mute, so I could yell at my husband. I'm wondering maybe if everybody heard me.

DIANE SANFILIPPO: Yes, they definitely heard you. I was like, oh I'm just going to keep talking now.

LIZ WOLFE: All right, so note to both of us. The mute button on this microphone does not work.

DIANE SANFILIPPO: Nope. I think it works.

LIZ WOLFE: Sorry about that, everybody. Yeah?

DIANE SANFILIPPO: Yeah…

LIZ WOLFE: Well, I hope so, but I did. He's being a wonderful, wonderful husband and he's putting stuff away and doing stuff in the kitchen, but I can hear feedback in my microphone…

DIANE SANFILIPPO: Clanking?

LIZ WOLFE: And I was going-I was going to mute it, and ask him to please stop being a wonderful husband for thirty minutes, but sorry about that.

DIANE SANFILIPPO: I think-so is the light on your mike red right now? Just solid red?

LIZ WOLFE: It is.

DIANE SANFILIPPO: Okay, I think when you push it, and it's blinking…in case anyone doesn't know, Liz and I have some really fancy microphones, and they're called a Yeti. It's this giant thing that makes us look like we're really important and on a legitimate radio station or something, so yeah, this giant Yeti of a microphone -I think when it's blinking, you'll be muted. Anyway, nobody else really needed to hear that. And we don't edit, so we won't be editing that out. People talk about editing stuff out all the time, and then they never do, so I'm like, I don't even know why you mention it. Why bother? Everyone can…

LIZ WOLFE: It's not going to happen.

DIANE SANFILIPPO: laugh at our lack of technical…

LIZ WOLFE: Oops.

DIANE SANFILIPPO: Anyway.

LIZ WOLFE: My comment on this whole-on the fertility thing, and this is really my [xxx 21:34], my [xxx 21:35] that I am aiming to work in specifically is in fertility management, and what I've loved so far is the fermented cod liver oil/butter oil blend from GreenPasture.org, that's just been hugely important, I think, for several women that I've spoken to. Love that. I think it's really important to get a fermented cod liver oil, just to make sure the vitamins A and D are balanced appropriately, and I love traditional fertility foods like organ meat and bone broth, stuff like that. A kind of Internet friend of mine has a website called Prenatalcoach.com, and she's a birth doula in, I think, Vancouver. She talks a lot about this stuff in her own journey toward pregnancy. She talks about some really cool stuff. She's on Facebook as well. But anything to increase that nutrient status, you know? Like you're building a new person.

DIANE SANFILIPPO: Mm-hmm.

LIZ WOLFE: Especially I think if you're spacing kids inside of three years.

DIANE SANFILIPPO: Yeah.

LIZ WOLFE: I think it's really important to just be aggressive with those nutrient -dense foods, with the bone broth, and stuff like that. And Paleo obviously is the perfect framework for that. Don't throw away egg yolks, you know, love the cholesterol rich egg yolk. It just makes me so sad when I hear Paleo people still kind of-that last vestige of cholesterol phobia.

DIANE SANFILIPPO: Yeah.

LIZ WOLFE: I think those are really important in hormone synthesis and stuff like that. And lastly, it's not 100% Paleo, but the book Real Food for Mother and Baby…

DIANE SANFILIPPO: Yeah, that's a good one.

LIZ WOLFE: by Nina Planck is a really, and you can get that on Kindle as well if you don't want to wait for Amazon to ship, so that's just my two cents on that.

DIANE SANFILIPPO: Yeah, I think those are good points, too , and not something that I've been looking at too, that sort of spacing, of how quickly people have the next child and you know, I get it, sometimes people kind of want to get it out of the way, but recognizing that each baby is sort of depleting your nutrient stores, and the reason for sometimes that timing is to re-up your stores, and as a second child in my family, you know, I can see how-and I've seen this in a couple of people-a couple of different sets of kids that I know, where just the second one sort of has less of an advantage, I guess, in terms of how much maybe the mom had stored up. And that's not like to freak anyone out or make anyone feel bad for having kids close together. It's not about that, it's just about getting people to recognize that that's a reality that really kind of-and you know, what you're saying about traditional cultures, that they would prep for becoming pregnant for what, a year at least ahead of time, you know.

LIZ WOLFE: Mm-hmm.

DIANE SANFILIPPO: This kind of really eating dense, nutrient-dense foods. I think organ meats are great, liver especially, if you can get pastured, grass-fed, that kind of thing and just not being afraid of that. And just finding a way to do it, you know. I don't care if you can't eat liver straight up. If you can eat it in pâté, I've got a recipe on my website, or if you mix it into red sauce over some spaghetti squash. Whatever you need to do, it's like, this is not a-You don't need to eat raw liver…

LIZ WOLFE: This is not a drill.

DIANE SANFILIPPO: to make it work. What did you say?

LIZ WOLFE: I said, this is not a drill. Like we're doing the organ meats…

DIANE SANFILIPPO: No.

LIZ WOLFE: But truly, like these are the most nutrient dense, like ancestrally valued whole foods that have really fallen out of favor in modern life. And there's a lot to be said for really just upping your nutrient status as much as possible when you have these little ones because obviously, it's not up to them. It's all about what you do. What an opportunity to love your baby before it actually shows up. Now I don't have any kids, so you know.

DIANE SANFILIPPO: Yeah.

LIZ WOLFE: I'm not super well versed in this whole deal, but just from what I've seen, it's an amazing opportunity and really profound for the people that really put their head down and focus on this stuff.

DIANE SANFILIPPO: Yeah. And that's a lot of what I think Chris did in his Healthy Baby Code is that he did a lot of research around traditional fertility diets, and so that's why I recommend that highly because I mean, he just went through this, I know, they have a new baby, and I definitely recommend that people check that out for something well rounded and also just, you know, realistic, you know, like he's not setting up anything for people that's completely out there and hippie-dippy.

LIZ WOLFE: Mm-hmm.

DIANE SANFILIPPO: It's real information and then also I think he also frames it in the, if you're living this way, what would be 80% of the time, you know that's important. You know, it's not something that you have to be nervous about.

LIZ WOLFE: Right.

DIANE SANFILIPPO: Just do this and you know, it's not anything to freak out, so cool. Hopefully, that's a good amount of information.

LIZ WOLFE: That's helpful.

DIANE SANFILIPPO: We'll link to some of those books and extras that we mentioned. We'll make sure that there are always links to things, so people can find them. So, cool.

LIZ WOLFE: All right. Good times, good times. Okay, Michael is next. Without eating a lot of fruit, okay. What would you say for someone who is trying to put on weight (muscle mass) for strength? I’m a crossfitter who trains hard (2 WODs per day 2-3 days per week) about 5-6 days per week. [xxx 26:51-53]. Might just be me. I feel like I’m not getting enough carbs, and I hate having to eat a lot of fruit. So is…

DIANE SANFILIPPO: Which I'm like, I don't get that.

LIZ WOLFE: What's that?

DIANE SANFILIPPO: Yeah, who hates eating fruit? No. I said, who hates eating fruit? No, but I think he was saying…

LIZ WOLFE: What's that? Oh my gosh.

DIANE SANFILIPPO: Like out of 5 or 6 days a week, he trains 2 or 3 of those days.

LIZ WOLFE: Gotcha.

DIANE SANFILIPPO: Because 2 a days. All right. Well.

LIZ WOLFE: That's a lot. Okay. That's a lot, Michael. My instinct on this is that if you are at the level of fitness, you got to cut out some of that metcon. I'm mean I'm assuming there's quite a bit of metcon standing here because that's kind of where you know the sexiness of Crossfit comes in. But yeah, if you just want to pile on the muscle mass, then the metcon's going to have to be dialed back, you could do, I would say 3-4 days per week of strength only. A ton of eggs, a mix of good fats, butter, [xxx 27:53] coconut oil, EVOO. I guess the carb overload is necessary to keep up with strength goals, metcon, sure, but as far as just the goal of building strength, I think we're on a different wavelength here, if that makes sense.

DIANE SANFILIPPO: Yeah, and so for people who might be listening who aren't doing Crossfit or like hearing all these abbreviations are like what are we talking about.

LIZ WOLFE: You mean the whole world doesn't know exactly what-Crossfit terminology?

DIANE SANFILIPPO: Well, WOD being Workout of the Day. These can be anywhere from like 5 to 35 minute training sessions. Usually they're around like 10-20 minutes. But I mean they can really be any combination of exercise, but like what Liz was saying, typically they tend to be very sort of cardio intensive. A metcon is usually very cardio intensive, short bursts, but very extreme level of exertion.

LIZ WOLFE: High exertion.

DIANE SANFILIPPO: Yeah, high intensity, so I mean, and this is stuff that we all-a bunch of us probably listen to a lot of these other podcasts out there, and I've definitely heard Greg over on Robb's podcast talking about you know when he's got guys who are trying to get bigger, he tells them, you know, don't run if you can walk, don't walk if you can sit, and don't sit if you can lay down. Like basically, stop burning more energy than you need to.

LIZ WOLFE: Stop moving.

DIANE SANFILIPPO: Yes, stop moving. Move very slowly and lift heavy things.

LIZ WOLFE: Brush your teeth, yeah.

DIANE SANFILIPPO: Like ee-ee-ee with the toothbrush. No. But if you're trying to build mass, just look at athletes who do different types of activity. If you look at a marathon runner, that's obviously one end of the extreme spectrum, but they are completely catabolic; their bodies have started eating their own muscle mass for fuel, so if you're not trying to get smaller than the whole metcon thing definitely I would just cut back on it. I mean, if you love doing metcons, okay, but you better fuel right for it. But do it way less. But you may need to eat more carbs. I have a pretty well rounded post on Paleo-friendly carbs. I just put that up a couple of weeks ago, so a chart on which vegetables you can use. I think I have like the top ten to fifteen-ish dense carb sources of vegetables, so go for those. You don't need to do it with fruit. It's not really a big deal if you don't want to eat fruit. I definitely agree with Liz on getting in lots of good fats. If you are more fat-adapted where you burn more fat for fuel, then yeah. Loading up on fats definitely. What I also tell people also in terms of weight gain, if you are eating any cheats, so if you're eating some, especially if it's gluten, or something, any grain products that you could be experiencing a reaction to, or could be causing some leaky gut response, to where you're not absorbing everything that you're eating, then cut that stuff out. So I don't know. He didn't mention it, but you know, if he's eating once a week or not even that often, if he's eating some bread or gluten or any other grains even, get rid of that stuff completely because if it's lowering your chances of getting in the absorption of all the foods you are eating, then it's kind of pointless. You know, like I just-if you're not absorbing everything, then what's the point of chowing down five pounds of you know, grass-fed ground beef over the course of a couple of days? So that's kind of my take on that.

LIZ WOLFE: Totally.

DIANE SANFILIPPO: And what are you eating? We don't know how much you're eating now, but I often see a very low intake of food, especially for men, and you really have to eat like you mean it. Like if you're trying to gain weight, you have to eat like you mean it, you have to have to eat possibly when you're not hungry, which is totally counterintuitive to what we generally tell people for health.

LIZ WOLFE: Mm-hmm.

DIANE SANFILIPPO: But if you're really trying to build up, you know, and I don't know how this could be difficult. I mean I'm like if somebody gave me a green light to eat as much food as I felt like eating all the time, that would be amazing.

LIZ WOLFE: Right?

DIANE SANFILIPPO: Like, you could call me up any time of day. Hey Diane, what are you doing? Oh, I'm just eating a big pile of meat. Like I would just be eating all the time if I needed to do that. But yeah, you really have to eat like you mean it. So it would be cool if you want to comment back on the blog post with what is a day's worth of food look like for you, are you sleeping, have to get all your ducks in a row in terms of just keeping the stress level in your system down, so that if you are training pretty hard, you know the rest of your body's allowed to just build up on the food that you are eating. So that's kind of what I think there. Don't know if I have any other notes on that. But that's pretty much it.

LIZ WOLFE: I think you did it. I mean.

DIANE SANFILIPPO: Yeah.

LIZ WOLFE: Yeah. And also you know, this may not apply to Michael, but give yourself an off-season. You know, there's not a whole lot of off-season when it comes to people who are doing hard-training, Crossfit type of activity, and I think for muscle-building, I do think you need to give yourself a little bit of an off-season just to alleviate a little of that stress stimulus on the body.

DIANE SANFILIPPO: Yeah. Yeah. And I will say too that I know people can get a little bit nuts about it, that they'll gain some body fat by not doing the metcon. I mean, I did this with myself over last winter, where I was just trying to lean out, but I wasn't trying to stress my system too much. I mean, I had my food dialed to a pretty low carb approach, but I also really just kept it to strength work five days a week. If I did any sort of metabolic conditioning, it was around five minutes. I just felt like I didn't want to move that fast. I just didn't have it in me because I wasn't eating a lot of carbohydrates at the time.

LIZ WOLFE: Mm-hmm.

DIANE SANFILIPPO: I mean, I stayed lean and even got a little leaner over that time and did increase strength, so that's my own personal experience with it, but it's just, you know, kind of myth that you'll just kind of gain fat if you're not doing metabolic work. It's really a matter of keeping your food dialed in, but yeah.

LIZ WOLFE: Definitely.

DIANE SANFILIPPO: To gain mass, eat a lot of it- eat a lot of food.

LIZ WOLFE: All right. Next question from Brenda. What's a good vitamin D supplement? Short and sweet, and all I really have to say about this one is from Mat Lalonde's seminar at the Academy of Lions. He mentioned D3 gelcaps. Can you possibly expand on that recommendation?

DIANE SANFILIPPO: D again! I haven't looked into that specific recommendation. I haven't been to Mat's seminar, but I know what I typically recommend and you know what's I've learned in my studying, what I've kind of been recommending to my clients as well, is an emulsified D3, so that just means it'll be like in a liquid form. It'll be combined with some kind of fat so it's a little bit easier to assimilate and digest. I'm guessing that those gelcaps are that form within the gelcap. If you're super sensitive to what the gelcap could be made from, typically I think it's a vegetable cellulose, so people probably wouldn't be, but just, on the off-chance that they are, the liquid might be a little bit easier to work with. And I think you can pretty much find those anywhere at like a Whole Foods. I know you can get them on Amazon. So that's kind of what I recommend for a vitamin D supplement. And you do want to make sure that it's D3, not D2. Most vitamin D supplements that you find are D3. Some that you might find in the cheaper multivitamin, it'll say D2. So just look for D3 specifically, that's the form that we do want. I also recommend that people test their vitamin D levels. You can do this at home. It's just a blood spot test. VitaminDCouncil.org has tests that you can order. You can buy one; I think it's between $50 and $60. Or you can get a set of a few. I want to say it's 4 at a time. I think that's a great idea to get all 4 of them. Maybe for yourself and a friend. Then you have a pre and a post-test, or you know, you can keep 4 for yourself so just do it every few months. This way you know where you're at before you start supplementing. So if you live in a climate that's not that sunny, you want to see what your levels are at any time of year and adjust your supplementation for that. For yourself and even your roommate, spouse, whoever might not need the same level of supplementation to get your vitamin D up in that like 60-80 range, which I think is probably what we want to be shooting for, but you know, your mileage may vary on how much supplementation you're doing. So I don't have a totally broad sweeping amount-she wasn't really asking for that anyway, but I definitely would like to see people just doing that test, and you know, you can order it for yourself, so that's pretty cool.

LIZ WOLFE: Yeah, that is cool.

DIANE SANFILIPPO: That's my take.

LIZ WOLFE: But as far as like your levels year round, I think this, and I think you and I think Kurt Harris-I've heard talk about this. Just kind of letting it fall as it naturally would a little bit in the winter-I would be more concerned with the sun exposure and getting those D levels up in the summer, maybe to carry you into the winter? Is that something you agree with?

DIANE SANFILIPPO: I think it really depends on the person.

LIZ WOLFE: Mm-hmm.

DIANE SANFILIPPO: I mean, that's natural, but we all live in such different climates now. We live in different places and wherever maybe our ancestry is rooted, and we're mutts, and so I think each person, you know. For the person who is 100% one type of ethnicity, whose seasonality, I don't know, might have been very normal. Winter is winter, summer is summer. If that feels okay for them and can stock up in the summer time, great. And if not, you know, I think it really depends on-people who, I've just a couple of notes on the whole-like vitamin D supplementation. For me, personally, I definitely see a change in my skin texture and the quality of my skin when I'm adding that supplement or I'm in the sun a lot. So that might be one reason why people might want to look into it. Mood and energy can really be affected by your vitamin D status. Your immunity level can be affected by your vitamin D status, so that could be one reason, too. If you're prone to getting sick a lot, if you have low vitamin D status going into the winter, it's like okay, even if you're going into winter, you might naturally have gotten less. I think supplementing with it can be okay.

LIZ WOLFE: Mm-hmm.

DIANE SANFILIPPO: I like the idea of being as ancestral in our approach as possible, but I think because we're mutts, I think because we live all over the place, it's really hard to know what's going to work for each person, so we just kind of have to stretch it out.

LIZ WOLFE: Ideal.

DIANE SANFILIPPO: Yeah.

LIZ WOLFE: And I think it's so interesting that you say you see an improvement with your skin with vitamin D. I've been kind of the opposite side of that spectrum, you know . Vitamin A, vitamin D being so synergistic with one another. I actually saw some amazing improvement in my skin when I started up the cod liver oil, which is a really rich source of vitamin A.

DIANE SANFILIPPO: Yeah.

LIZ WOLFE: So it's so interesting to me like the different, like you said, it's so biologically individual from person to person…

DIANE SANFILIPPO: Yeah.

LIZ WOLFE: If you experience like an evening out or like a synergy between vitamin A and D when you up the D…

DIANE SANFILIPPO: Yeah.

LIZ WOLFE: And you know, I think maybe my vitamin D status is pretty good. I just added A from the cod liver oil, and the butter oil blend, and I blogged about it actually on CaveGirlEats.com. I mean, my skin looked like a different person within a week. So I don't know.

DIANE SANFILIPPO: I just actually ordered some of that stuff, too.

LIZ WOLFE: Mm-hmm.

DIANE SANFILIPPO: Because I think you mentioned this at some point, you know, skin being one of your goals with this whole Paleo thing, like figuring that out.

LIZ WOLFE: Yeah.

DIANE SANFILIPPO: And that's definitely been one for me, and you know, we're totally like off topic, but whatever. But I think-whatever. But I think I saw a lot of, I'm still trying to figure it out, like some hormonal imbalances, after years of being on or off the Pill, and that kind of thing affecting my system, and obviously getting all the crappy foods out over several years, but figuring out the vitamin D when I tried fish oil at first, I didn't respond well to it. I think I broke out more, but I did just get some of the cod liver oil. I haven't taken it yet. I'm like not the best at taking things, so if I start taking it..

LIZ WOLFE: Oh, what kind did you get?

DIANE SANFILIPPO: I did get the Green Pastures. I got an emulsified one, and I got some of the butter oil as well. I think those are in caps.

LIZ WOLFE: Yeah.

DIANE SANFILIPPO: But you know, I'm really big on, like if I take a supplement, and I can actually feel or see the effects of it, I'm better at continuing to take it.

LIZ WOLFE: Mm-hmm.

DIANE SANFILIPPO: And the vitamin D I noticed. I noticed that when I take it, like the next day, I can tell the texture of my skin just-it feels good when I wake up. It's so noticeable for me, so but I think you're right. I think it's that if I'm taking the D, it's because I'm probably eating some carotenoids, and I'm eating some vitamin A, but just not actively working, and that balance just comes together. I put something up about this too on my Facebook page, the Balanced Bites Facebook page, about if people have bumps on their arms, like the upper arm, that can be a balance…

LIZ WOLFE: Keratosis pilaris.

DIANE SANFILIPPO: Yeah, keratosis pilaris, the balance of the vitamin A and D status, so that's another one for people to kind of look out for. Anyway, now that we've talked about who knows what.

LIZ WOLFE: Tangent.

DIANE SANFILIPPO: Yeah, tangent, hello! We're coming back.

LIZ WOLFE: That's all right. We have a captive audience.

DIANE SANFILIPPO: Make sure we have a…Yeah, everyone's like stuck in traffic listening to this, like what are these girls talking about now?

LIZ WOLFE: Who are these people? All right. Next question from Kathleen. I like this one. PMS and carb cravings. Premenstrual carbohydrate cravings- why does it happen and how to fix the problem, let's see, I'm going to read this-I guess basically we're asking what to eat which satisfies that craving or how to eat? My first reaction is when you figure this out, let me know.

DIANE SANFILIPPO: Yeah. I mean, I don't really have tons of information on this, you know, really specifically. Like oh, here's exactly what's causing it, but I mean, pretty common sense to me that just that hormonal shift at that time of the month can really adjust how you're feeling in terms of what kinds of foods you want, and any hormone shift can adjust our blood sugar, and you know, this is something we see a lot n women who first get pregnant with that really big hormone shift, blood sugar moving around a lot, getting carb cravings or feeling nauseous, so cravings and nausea can also both be pointing to just blood sugar-blood sugar imbalances as a reflection of hormonal imbalances. So yeah, I think the hormonal imbalances is just at the root of this. Any lack of sleep is definitely not going to set you up well. So make sure that you're sleeping really well at that point in time. And I would say to just focus on keeping good protein and fat in your meals. If you get the cravings, go with it, and just keep it to some low glycemic fruits, if you want them, something that has some other nutrient density, so you're not just chowing on, I don't know, candy.

LIZ WOLFE: Mm-hmm.

DIANE SANFILIPPO: At least if it's some fruit, where you're getting some nutrition from that. Or just some really dark chocolate, something that's dense. I would leave the house for this stuff. Get something that's a single serving and then don't keep it around the house so you can just scavenge it all the time. That's part of that little emotional frenzy that might happen at that point, too. And I just wouldn't let it stress you out, you know, if it hits you for a day or two. Go with it, and then just let it go when it's gone and don't worry that you like flipped out on some berries for a day or two. Like, okay, so what? You know, not the big-I just don't know why people beat themselves up over that stuff because it happens. You know, it happens to me, too.

LIZ WOLFE: Right.

DIANE SANFILIPPO: I don't know. I mean, I can do the one or two squares of dark chocolate sometimes, and then sometimes I'm like I just ate that whole bar. I didn't think it was that critical.

LIZ WOLFE: No, I'm against eating a square. You got to eat the whole bar. Come on. Just do it.

DIANE SANFILIPPO: I mean, I don't think it's difficult. I don't-this goes back to my not understanding of people who can't eat enough. I'm like, really? I wish I had that problem.

LIZ WOLFE: I know.

DIANE SANFILIPPO: Yeah, I wouldn't freak out about it, but it's just some hormonal imbalances, and usually, we talked about this last time, too. You know, if you are keeping a really low sugar diet most of the time, that can really help your situation going into each period. Caffeine can really affect this. I know, one of my friends through Facebook who I've actually met now-her name's Wendy-she was talking caffeine really affecting her period, so you know whether it's cramps or cravings, yeah, watching that.

LIZ WOLFE: Yeah. I do think just as far as like cravings, I think a lot of times like when that self-judgment, that “Oh, I'm not supposed to do this.”

DIANE SANFILIPPO: Yeah.

LIZ WOLFE: When those kind of thoughts creep in, these things can kind of intensify, kind of like this feed-forward type of thing. So just be cool, man. You know? Have some berries, you know, have some chocolate covered whatever and just don't get too, too spun-up about it. Keep that mental stability as priority one, if you can.

DIANE SANFILIPPO: Yup. Cool.

LIZ WOLFE: There you go. All right, next one from Shannon in Hawaii. That must be terrible. Living in Hawaii. I recently watched the documentary Food Matters-awesome- and found it fascinating. With regard to fruits and vegetables, it really stressed that we should try to eat them in their raw state. I eat lots of fruit raw, but veggies I tend to steam or roast, with the occasional salad or snack of raw veggies. Should I be worried that I am not getting enough of the correct nutrients and consequently supplement? What do you think, Diane?

DIANE SANFILIPPO: Good on you for watching that documentary. I watch a lot of those food/nutrition geek documentaries on Netflix. Those are kind of fun to watch with your buds who are…

LIZ WOLFE: Yeah.

DIANE SANFILIPPO: keen to this stuff. I think, with regards to raw vs. cooked foods, you know, we're definitely getting a lot of nutrients in our raw foods, live enzymes. Vitamins can be very heat sensitive, so we're probably killing some of that stuff when we heat our food. That said, you know, those are on the plus side of the raw food. That said, and this is something that Mat Lalonde talked about a bunch at the Ancestral Health Symposium, with regards to lectins in plant foods. You know we're really able to break down more of the anti-nutrients that are present in pretty much all plant foods, and specifically, the ones that don't have other, obvious defense mechanisms, like thorns or hard outer shells or peels, those kinds of things. You know, we can be breaking down some of the hard to digest properties when we cook food, so I mean, in my general take on this is eat foods that seem palatable naturally raw. If they don't seem super palatable raw, cooking them is probably a good idea. I don't really have too much to geek out on with this.

LIZ WOLFE: Mm-hmm.

DIANE SANFILIPPO: Just kind of go with what feels good. I love having like a huge salad. I think Mark Sisson calls it the-ah, I don't want to say it. I don't want to curse, we have a clean rating, but he has this…

LIZ WOLFE: Earmuffs, earmuffs.

DIANE SANFILIPPO: big, deep salad. You know, just throwing all kinds of veggies over some lettuce, and maybe a mix of some leftover cooked stuff, and I think there's a little bit of fruit or some raw nuts. I mean, just eat stuff that tastes good raw, but I wouldn't stress over it too much. I just-incorporate it.

LIZ WOLFE: I really like that perspective. Yeah.

DIANE SANFILIPPO: Yeah.

LIZ WOLFE: Well, I would like just to add that I think that this is a problem that a lot of these native cultures that say Weston A. Price looked at. They kind of maybe perceived that this problem of anti-nutrients and/or [xxx 49:01-03] were kind of where fermenting can come in. As far as many active nutrients as possible…

DIANE SANFILIPPO: Fermenting? Is that what you said?

LIZ WOLFE: [xxx 49:10] Yeah. Yeah.

DIANE SANFILIPPO: You're-somehow your mike fades out on the most important word of each sentence each time. I'm like, oh my God.

LIZ WOLFE: I have it set to that. Is that not the right setting? I have it set to the don't let anyone understand what you're saying setting.

DIANE SANFILIPPO: Yeah, so no one understands what you're saying.

LIZ WOLFE: [xxx 49:29] It's very cool.

DIANE SANFILIPPO: It's a good thing that I can just predict-that you were trying to say fermenting, but you actually said nothing at all because [laugh]. Yeah. I'm with you on that. Fermenting foods, definitely.

LIZ WOLFE: Yeah, and it's real easy. There's a book I think called Wild Fermentation, which is really interesting, but there's a ton of Internet resources on that, if you wanted to go for it. I mean, really all you need is salt, water, and a jar, so.

DIANE SANFILIPPO: Yeah, and that keeps them raw, lots of live enzymes, and yeah, geek out on your fermented raw veggies.

LIZ WOLFE: Definitely. All right. second question, and I guess, let's see, this might be the last one because I think we're going to attack this one pretty good. This also is from Shannon. and she says, Robb Wolf and others have talked about intermittent fasting. Nutritionally, how does this help or hurt the body? I am on my last 8 pounds to lose and have plateaued for a month and thought I might try this, but don’t know how often or how long.

DIANE SANFILIPPO: Okay. This is a good question, and I tried to compile a bunch of perspectives on this, and you know, as I've said a million times now, we'll definitely link to the references I'm going to give you here, so that you can dig a little deeper on this. The general-my general take on intermittent fasting is first and foremost, I think it's a great thing if your blood sugar regulation is good. So what does that mean? That means if you can go without eating for six plus hours, and you don't feel like a zombie or a maniac or you're about to pass out, then it might be something that you can approach. Typically, people who are just making a shift away from a refined food, high carb processed food diet, it's not the best approach for them. Blood sugar regulation is critical to the start of any regaining health plan.

LIZ WOLFE: Mm-hmm.

DIANE SANFILIPPO: You know, it's like anything we talk about, and actually this is something at the Ancestral Health Symposium, anyone was talking about whether it was the high carb, high fat, low carb debate, or talking about leptin or insulin, any of it, it all comes back to, first and foremost, your own blood sugar regulation and whatever works for you because if you don't have that throughout the day, and you're on a rollercoaster, then it doesn't really matter what approach you're taking, you need to fix that first. So anyway, from sort of the common sense, evolutionary, hunter-gatherer perspective of what is intermittent fasting. it's just sort of this [xxx 52:07] I didn't find food. You know, and it's not really a big deal, probably. This is something I learned about in my own approach to it. I'm not good at intermittent fasting. I love food too much. Like I'll wake up super excited to eat every day. [xxx 52:27-28] I mean, it's like Christmas morning every day, like yeah, breakfast! I mean, it doesn't mean I never skip it, but I mean, I think, going, doing like a MovNat routine, which I was on that for [xxx 52:43-52] I mean, just recognizing that you can probably [xxx 52:55] without food as quickly as you think you need it. A lot of it is a mental game in a sense, and it's not about like depriving yourself or starvation or any of that, but recognizing that like you will be okay if you wait another couple of hours to eat. So that's just kind of the perspective of like what is this whole intermittent fasting thing, you know. A lot of people just treat it as “Okay, I was busy through lunch so I happened to not eat lunch. I happened to just skip that meal.” And just being very opportunistic about it. In terms of timing or how to approach it, from what I've read and researched, around 16-18 hours can be a good amount of time. That's pretty easy to hit if you stop eating dinner around like 5 or 6 o'clock in the evening, and then have a late breakfast the next day. Whatever timing seems to be easy for you. Anything that's going to add stress to this is not going to be a good idea. So if it's easy for you? Go for it. Try it. Fasted training in the morning can be a good thing. Just to, you know, again, unless you're waking u and you feel starving. Sometimes you can give it a little bit of time. I've recommended this to a handful of clients to just try it. Sometimes you wake up and you're really hungry. Have some water or lemon water and wait 20-30 minutes, and you might not actually be as hungry as you think. It might just be that mental-sort of your views to waking up and just going to grab some food right away.

LIZ WOLFE: Mm-hmm.

DIANE SANFILIPPO: But what's happening when we have an intermittent fast going on, we just don't eat for awhile, we're letting our body complete this process called autophagy, which-It's the body's own time to do some cellular cleanup. It's sort of-our body can metabolically digest different parts of cells and it's sort of-I guess it's sort of digesting parts of cells that would be protein-based so our body sort of self-sounds kind of gross-but like self-eating and like cleans..

LIZ WOLFE: Or like scavenging.

DIANE SANFILIPPO: Yeah, scavenging and like the clean up process of just cellular components that we don't need anymore, and so I've also kind of read a bit about. If you are doing an intermittent fast, but you do want something, the benefit comes primarily from not eating protein for that amount of time, so if you did want to do like a spoonful of coconut oil, something like that just to get some calories in, you're still going to get most of the benefits of that intermittent fast by avoiding the protein. So you know, and some more simplified terms, what's happening when you're not eating, it's just your body's chance to use its own stores for energy. So partially what I was just talking about with those protein of the autophagy. Also, if you're looking to be in a ketogenic state, where your body's able to burn its own fat for energy more efficiently, the intermittent fast might be a good way to approach that a little bit more easily because when your body is not pulling in calories all the time from food, you actually have food sitting in your fat stores, so your body can use that for energy more efficiently. So those are some benefits of intermittent fasting. I think it's a natural, normal, healthy thing to do, if you have good blood sugar regulation and if it doesn't add stress to your life. Just finding a way that it works for you. I think most people I've talked to about the subject and most are sort of mentors in this community, we tend to talk about it, like I said, as an opportunistic, and you know, I just happened to not eat at that point. It's not always planned, it's not something they freak out about. I think from the perspective of people who might be emotional eaters, you know, Liz and I talked about this a little bit, if you have issues around late-night eating, I think sometimes telling yourself that you're not supposed to eat right now because you're doing an intermittent fast gives you a different way to frame the fact that like, no I shouldn't be eating more food right now because I'm not hungry, but maybe giving yourself another purpose with it, like no, this is actually doing something beneficial for my body, to not eat right now, besides the fact that I'm even hungry, and I'm just scavenging because for whatever reason I just feel like noshing on food. You know, it can be something to just think about. I'll put a few links to some of the Paleo Solution podcasts. I know they've talked about this a bunch and if you want to geek out some more on the science around it, a few of the different episodes there, they've talked about intermittent fasting and sort of the autophagy, and I also found some good resources over on the Perfect Health Diet from Paul Jaminet-excuse me-where he-his approach to intermittent fasting, you know, if you concentrate your food intake, so sometimes they called it punctuated eating, if you concentrate your food intake during an eight hour window, daylight times, preferably, even towards like later daylight times, then a 16 hour fast can help reducing your blood sugar and insulin levels and your hormonal response is just little bit more even and healthier throughout the day, so I think that's something that is interesting as well as an effect, so I'll put a couple of extra links as resources over on the perfecthealthdiet.com if people want to read some more details on it. But yeah, what's your take on intermittent fasting? Do you ever do it? Or what's your deal?

LIZ WOLFE: Well, I don't typically do it because like you said that means I'm not eating.

DIANE SANFILIPPO: Mm-hmm. yeah. [laughs] That's not fun.

LIZ WOLFE: Yeah, not cool. No, actually, if I'm not hungry at breakfast time, I don't eat. You know, I just kind of go with my hunger on that stuff, and when I'm pretty clean with the diet, I can trust those instincts and kind of roll with them. I do like a lot of the stuff that Paul Jaminet has to say on like ketosis and intermittent fasting. I like particularly the way he uses coconut oil.

DIANE SANFILIPPO: Mm-hmm.

LIZ WOLFE: So yeah, I definitely think that's a great place for people to hop over there at perfecthealthdiet.com and just check out some of his stuff on there. But yeah, I think you nailed it.

DIANE SANFILIPPO: Cool, and you know, my approach to this to, just in my life, when I first moved away from a really high carb diet, the idea of skipping a meal was like, oh heck no! There's no way I can make it because I was one of those zombie…

LIZ WOLFE: Terrifying.

DIANE SANFILIPPO: Sugar crash-yeah, I mean, and the anxiety around the possibility of getting too hungry and the mood swings I would have, so I mean, it's such a relief to be fat adapted and fat fueled, where I know if I'm hungry, that I can wait another couple of hours, and I've got body fat that my body can burn for energy and that it will burn because I'm not eating, you know, tons of carbs all the time, and so I don't get that same bottom out of a crash, and it's a relief. And it's not necessarily an intermittent fast in the terms we're really talking about here, that extended 16 hour, 18 hour thing, but I mean, it is still a little bit of that, you know, again opportunistic, like there's no good food available right now, but I'll be okay.

LIZ WOLFE: Mm-hmm. Right.

DIANE SANFILIPPO: So that's kind of yeah, my take on that.

LIZ WOLFE: And I definitely like the point, if it's associated with some kind of stress for you, then it's something you need to think about, you know. If you're using not eating as a punishment or I ate too much yesterday and I can't eat until 3 o'clock tomorrow, you know, like…

DIANE SANFILIPPO: Yeah.

LIZ WOLFE: Gauge that kind of stress association in your mind. But really now when I was the carb queen, I mean, I turned down a job right out of college because it wasn't close enough to the Panera, so I feel like…

DIANE SANFILIPPO: Boo.

LIZ WOLFE: So anyway, there you go. All right, well, we're at an hour now.

DIANE SANFILIPPO: Yeah, I think that's pretty much it. We've got tons of questions here, so we'll be rolling right along for the coming weeks.

LIZ WOLFE: Yeah.

DIANE SANFILIPPO: But any other kind of announcements or news you want to make sure that people hear out there? Or just kind of the usual, check out our blogs .

LIZ WOLFE: Yeah, I think the usual. I'm going to get some-there is actually U.S. Wellness Meats , a company that we-a lot of us kind of in the Paleo community are familiar with, environmentally responsible, humanely raised, pasture based meats, and they ship which is great for a lot of people who just don't have local resources available. I'm going to be running just kind of a little-just a little, not contest, but a little giveaway type deal on my blog, so let me know if you've been wanting to try their stuff, but weren't sure, so [xxx 1:01:54] you might want to look for that next week.

DIANE SANFILIPPO: Cool.

LIZ WOLFE: If you're ever going to pop over and read my nonsense next week, that might be the time to do it.

DIANE SANFILIPPO: That's cool. Yeah, their meat is fantastic.

LIZ WOLFE: And they're great people, you know?

DIANE SANFILIPPO: So nice, yeah, I'm so bummed you weren't at the Ancestral Health Symposium. We [xxx 1:02:14] They fed us. I remember there was one day for lunch , we're like, I don't know why-I just didn't-I didn't feel like leaving and getting lunch somewhere, and I swear that I must have eaten like a pound of jerky that they gave me, so yeah, they're great people.

LIZ WOLFE: Amazing.

DIANE SANFILIPPO: Awesome.

LIZ WOLFE: I missed out on the meat party.

DIANE SANFILIPPO: Meat party [laughs]. Oh my gosh. All right cool. That's it.

LIZ WOLFE: Why did I have to say meat party, Diane? I don't know.

DIANE SANFILIPPO: We'll catch you guys next week.

LIZ WOLFE: Bye everybody. Talk to you later, Diane.

DIANE SANFILIPPO: Bye.

LIZ WOLFE: Bye.

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Cheers!
Diane & Liz